14 yo DD Part II

[tom.guerry]

FFS -

On the surface, it looks like Giambi pronates then supinates then pronates then supinates the lead arm:

http://efastball.com/images/baseball/hitting-swing-plane-giambi.gif

What do you think is going on under the hood ?

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYos-uqfoLc

 

[Wellphyt]

It's basically practicing getting to the position highlighted below with a 'red' Vee.

I agree that this is an important position to teach.

 

[RayR]

I disagree....this position is a pass through position....it is not a static position to strive for....if you work down to the ball initially with the front shoulder as the hands go back or back and up....your hands will automatically learn to pass through the "V" position. If your body is trying to work up to the ball...as your hands are dropping...you will have trouble passing through....if you teach this position statically...the rear shoulder will want to drop prematurely trying to get there....dropping your hands in the process....

IMO...there is way too much emphasis on getting the lead shoulder up and working the front elbow up....this is why kids have trouble with spinning...they need to learn how to position the body correctly and use the hands...specifically the bottom hand....front shoulder down/forward to the ball as your hands go back and you will shift forward....

And speaking of throwing....stop teaching girls to get the ball up in a "L" position....this elevates the front shoulder....we teach our catchers to throw from there knees as the front shoulder works back and down. They throw better from there knees then most girls throw standing up....this forces them to rotate their upper body to throw the ball and they fall foward as they throw...

 

[SBFAMILY]

I'm going to bet these young girls will have knee or ankle issues with this swing. Read the poss on weight transfer with back knee.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

I disagree....this position is a pass through position....it is not a static position to strive for....if you work down to the ball initially with the front shoulder as the hands go back or back and up....your hands will automatically learn to pass through the "V" position. If your body is trying to work up to the ball...as your hands are dropping...you will have trouble passing through....if you teach this position statically...the rear shoulder will want to drop prematurely trying to get there....dropping your hands in the process....

IMO...there is way too much emphasis on getting the lead shoulder up and working the front elbow up....this is why kids have trouble with spinning...they need to learn how to position the body correctly and use the hands...specifically the bottom hand....front shoulder down/forward to the ball as your hands go back and you will shift forward....

And speaking of throwing....stop teaching girls to get the ball up in a "L" position....this elevates the front shoulder....we teach our catchers to throw from there knees as the front shoulder works back and down. They throw better from there knees then most girls throw standing up....this forces them to rotate their upper body to throw the ball and they fall foward as they throw...

I know you work with multiple hitters. What I've found is that passing through this position is not always natural.

I’m fine with the disagreement. Whether ‘natural’ or ‘not natural’ for a hitter, I want passing through this position to be fairly routine. I do use a drill in which a hitter goes through their normal swing and stops in this position ... it is a full speed swing in which the hitter basically performs a late 'check swing'. It helps re-inforce the concept of a "tight HPP" and hitting through a "Power-Vee", as opposed to a "Lazy-L". Later, in BP, if a hitter is struggling in this area a simple cue of "Power-Vee" reminds them of this drill and has them immediately improving the tightness of their HPP.

 

[Wellphyt]

It's basically practicing getting to the position highlighted below with a 'red' Vee.

I view all positions in hitting as pass through positions. These players are paused very close to what Epstein describes as the "torque position". Much of his teaching system is built around getting to this basic position "on time". Notice the position of the hands, arms and elbows (not so much the clip of Pujols as IMO he is paused a frame or two too late). Noticed how balanced they are - level hips. I don't see a lot of girls at the 14u level getting to this good hitting position. Obviously when facing live hitting we don't want players to stop at this position. However, IMO this a really good position to be thinking; "throw the barrel" or "throw the hands". IOW once a hitter gets to this position the swing is essentially over.

I don't recommend this, but my DD hit from Epstein's #1 position her second year of 10u. When the pitcher started her windup, my DD would go to toe touch and stop. Her upper body would be in Epstein's bat-on-the-deltoid training position, which Epstein calls the "universal launch" position. From that position all she had to do is drop her heel. She hit really, really well against some pretty fast pitchers in All-Stars that year. Basically she was hitting live pitching from a drill position; and having success. Sometimes at the younger ages it helps to totally remove the player's style from the swing, which is basically the approach Epstein uses in his dvds.

As my DD got older, we had a very hard time wrapping my DD's style around the technique part of the swing. At the time there wasn't any information available to show us how to do this. I had to figure it out on my own. Many of the issues I see in swings is IMO related to players not understanding how to transition from their batting stance(style), to the technique part of the swing. This is where stop swings have helped us. Sometimes I get ridiculed for my emphasis on slotting the back elbow correctly and working the front forearm up correctly. My emphasis in this area is really tied to what I learned while teaching my DD how to transition from her stance(style), to the "universal launch" position(technique).

 

[Jeff Kneiert]

we teach our catchers to throw from there knees as the front shoulder works back and down. They throw better from there knees then most girls throw standing up....this forces them to rotate their upper body to throw the ball and they fall foward as they throw...

Ray, can you tell me more about this?

 

[RayR]

Check your PMs Jeff

 

[RayR]

That's fine...I understand your position....I am just seeing a problem with my girls winging front elbow as it is....getting to a static power V would only reinforce that....I don't mind if the elbow ramps up....but mainly as an effect....to practice it for every swing doesn't help hitting low pitches especially low inside....

I know you work with multiple hitters. What I've found is that passing through this position is not always natural.

I’m fine with the disagreement. Whether ‘natural’ or ‘not natural’ for a hitter, I want passing through this position to be fairly routine. I do use a drill in which a hitter goes through their normal swing and stops in this position ... it is a full speed swing in which the hitter basically performs a late 'check swing'. It helps re-inforce the concept of a "tight HPP" and hitting through a "Power-Vee", as opposed to a "Lazy-L". Later, in BP, if a hitter is struggling in this area a simple cue of "Power-Vee" reminds them of this drill and has them immediately improving the tightness of their HPP.