Rotational Hitting

[David May]

Posey,

I couldn't agree more. That is why I say she kills mistakes (pitches just off middle to inside and up), but the pitches she struggles with most is the outside and low pitches. Muscle memory takes over from the drils and she simply can't adjust without her mechanics breaking down.

As she gets older, the competition improves and the pitchers get even more consistent hitting their spots, I am concerned she is going to struggle once they see where her weak zones are (and they will figure it out). That was what i was referring to about the "ceiling" and "holes" conclusions...

Suggestions?

 

[TeamPosey13]

David,

I can tell you that I use to struggle with the same thing. I would KILL balls inside... most of them would go foul and I could not touch the outside pitch. I too was taught to spin my hips at a young age. I would suggest that when you are practicing with her, have her focus on staying square to the plate (her hips will open naturally... not to force it) and to push off of her back foot (not pivot it) (her back heel should be pushing to the ball). If she does this and thinks about throwing her hands (or the knob of the bat) to the ball and bat head through the pitcher it would probably straighten her out. However, it will take A LOT of work... getting kids out of "spinning" takes a lot of work bc they are wired to spin open. When she swings while practicing, have her hold her finish (kind of like freezing after she finishes) to see where her weight is. Her weight shoud be centered... not back. That is a start. THe problem with having an athlete think of starting with their hips first pulls them off of the ball and their bat angle now begins to go towards the 3rd baseman instead of the pitcher. That is why it is so hard to cover the outside pitch. And I can attest to you that at the higher levels (college and international), 80% of the pitches are outside. I hope that helps a little bit. If she focuses on getting in an athletic position, standing tall and throwing her hands should help her to start. If you have any other questions, I am happy to help.

 

[3'sDad]

I've been following this a have a question of why the counter-rotation at the beginning of the swing is perceived to perhaps be at fault. I tried it (before letting DD experiment) and it felt to me like the rubber band was being wound to release the bat at impact, similar to an old-fashioned forward press in a golf swing was used to get the "golf motor" running to hit a shot. Slightly closing the lead shoulder (left - for a RHB) with the navel still pointed at home plate felt like a very strong powerful hitting position to me.

Can the group let me know where the fatal flaw is in this model. Happy to learn so DD doesn't need to be retaught improper mechanics.
Thanks

 

[TeamPosey13]

Just to clarify, what do you mean by counter rotation? Do you mean your shoulders turn in towards the catcher and your hips rotate?

 

[David May]

Posey

Sent you a message....thanks!!

 

[KAT]

my opinion but you know what they say about opinions

ok maybe I am all wet here. But when I look at alex it seems as if he actually transfers some of his weight forward, his back foot gets very light. Like he pivots on his front hip area with some weight transfering there while he lifts or almost lifts his back foot.. ok you can bash me now I need to learn this

 

[Hit Dr.24]

KAT, Look at Vinny Castilla and Ken Griffey also and tell me what you see.

 

[Mark H]

David,

I can tell you that I use to struggle with the same thing. I would KILL balls inside... most of them would go foul and I could not touch the outside pitch. I too was taught to spin my hips at a young age. I would suggest that when you are practicing with her, have her focus on staying square to the plate (her hips will open naturally... not to force it).

I'm not sure what you mean here? If you are saying focusing on opening the hips first can lead to problems with young hitters yeah and that's a long discussion of motor learning theory and learning progressions. If you are saying the hips don't open before the shoulders and torso in elite hitters I disagree. If you are saying don't do it like Bagwell, yeah. The "separation"/hips opening ahead of shoulders and hands happens mostly during the stride/momentum development/foward by turning in elite hitters not named Bagwell.

and to push off of her back foot.

Sort of. When and how. To me, telling a kid to push off the back foot often has them thinking knee extension and has them pushing the hip around when in fact elite hitters don't have weight on that foot during hip rotation.

(not pivot it).

Agreed.

(her back heel should be pushing to the ball)..

Don't know what you mean on this one.

If she does this and thinks about throwing her hands (or the knob of the bat) to the ball.

Not sure what you mean here either. How would you compare your words to this clip? Photo 18 of 31, Analysis

and bat head through the pitcher it would probably straighten her out. However, it will take A LOT of work... getting kids out of "spinning" takes a lot of work bc they are wired to spin open..

Agreed. Englishbey has good drills for this.

When she swings while practicing, have her hold her finish (kind of like freezing after she finishes) to see where her weight is. Her weight shoud be centered... not back. That is a start. THe problem with having an athlete think of starting with their hips first pulls them off of the ball.

Can. Depends on how you start the hips. Need a little momentum into rotation with the front hip quickly stopping and create more of a swinging gate rotation with the the hip rotation more around the front hip joint rather than around the center of the pelvis or worse the back hip joint.

and their bat angle now begins to go towards the 3rd baseman instead of the pitcher. .

Saw a lot of that at the WCWS.

That is why it is so hard to cover the outside pitch..

Surely a big part of it, yes.

And I can attest to you that at the higher levels (college and international), 80% of the pitches are outside. I hope that helps a little bit. If she focuses on getting in an athletic position, standing tall .

To me athletic position and standing tall are opposite things. How are you defining these terms?

and throwing her hands should help her to start..

Again, there is throwing the hands with connected rotation and the hands staying back near the back shoulder through the earlier part of rotation or there is throwing the hands like the video I linked. I'm interested to hear your thoughts on this.

Lots of good and insightful comments on Epstein. I'll avoid piling on unless questioned on something specific.

 

[Mark H]

ok maybe I am all wet here. But when I look at alex it seems as if he actually transfers some of his weight forward, his back foot gets very light. Like he pivots on his front hip area with some weight transfering there while he lifts or almost lifts his back foot.. ok you can bash me now I need to learn this

Bingo. You rang the bell and win the kewpie doll. Very good observations IMO.

 

[Hit Dr.24]

MarkH that clip you posted is not throwing the hands thats pushing very weak! Throwing the hands is what A-Rod does in the overhead view of his motion analysis.You can tell he has excellent connection of legs,core and arms.