Why do you think he throws so fast???

[STRIKE3]

Awesome @Hillhouse and you are no doubt telling the truth. older DD played for the Glory for a bit and went to that facility. Good place and in the middle of nowhere TX IMO. Tough week of weather for all of us here in N Texas.

 

[BrianTx01]

The

Well, the daily work outs are at the Texas Rangers Youth Facility, I have no idea where that is but it's not an overly nice neighborhood. It's an all turf field, they're practicing on a baseball field with no fixed bases and no rubbers fixed into the ground on the field or bullpens. I'm not sure why they picked this place but I'm not in charge of logistics. We are staying up near the Galleria mall area at some Marriot Residence place. It's a solid 20 min drive from hotel to ballpark. Yesterday we went to the Texas Glory facility (McKinney?) and they did a scrimmage until they were too cold and cancelled. Tomorrow we're back at the Rangers facility, fans are not allowed (although I'm not sure what they'd do if someone showed up and just sat in the bleachers). The team isn't allowed to interact with anyone for autographs, pics, etc. And there's talk that this weekend's 3 game set vs. Mexico will be cancelled due to dangerously low temps. They're calling for temps in the 30's here in Dallas which is just too low for softball. I thought yesterday was too low also but they did about 5 innings... while I sat in my rental car!!

The Texas Rangers Youth Academy is at Pinkston high school in West Dallas. It isn't the worst neighborhood in Dallas but it isn't the best.

 

[Hillhouse]

ALL games vs. Mexico have been cancelled due to weather and forecast (in case anyone was planning on sneaking over to watch). Mexico arrived yesterday and they will just do a work out camp at the Ranger's place in the afternoons, USA trains in the mornings. We were informed today that they're going to end camp sooner than expected and start sending us home Friday or Saturday instead of Monday since there's snow in the forecast for Monday.

What practices remain are inside the Ranger's indoor facility at that same complex. It's a pretty big indoor place, almost big enough for a full softball game indoors. Batting cages drop from the ceiling and there's ways to drop nets to section off the entire field. Bullpens go in the morning (9am) then team practice is at 9:45-10 ish... I throw BP to the lefties only since the other guy here helping cannot throw to lefties, he has some kind of phobia. lol. I don't particularly enjoy lefties either but, the other guy can't do it period. In his defense, he's not and never was a full time pitcher. But, he throws BP to his college team (some D3 school in Minneapolis) and coaches the Pride NPF team. We finish at 12:30 and Mexico starts at 1pm.

This was my first time being around the women's team in over 20 years, and none of the same players are around from 20 years ago (except for Kelly Krutchman, or however its spelled) who is running the practices since ALL of the Olympic coaches are with their college teams. I've been shocked at how many of them are constantly signing balls and other items for each other. It's not uncommon for someone to ask Cat or Monica to sign a ball for someone they know back home, and they all seem to be doing it for each other. I was surprised by that.

The practices are interesting to say the least. I'll save my thoughts on that for another time.

 

[PDM]

Hmmm, I'd have to double check on that but, I don't think Jeremy ever won an ISC World. Remember, that is the club championships not National teams. I know he won the ISF/WBSC World in 2013 in New Zealand (while pitching for NZ) but I don't think he ever won an ISC. In fact, I think 2005 was the year he and I had a 12 inning game against each other. Get this, I had an 11 2/3 inning no-hitter that game and LOST. I'm pretty sure 2005 was in Eau Claire WI, but that doesn't take away Jeremey pitching. He was one of the best in the world for a period of time. Like me, he usually played for teams that didn't have hitting. One year he did have good hitting was 2011 (I think) and he went all the way to the championship losing to Folkard's team in the finals. That's the only ISC final I remember him in. I was unlucky enough to have 3 runner up ISC finishes in my career... never making it over the hump.

But, you are correct about speeds. 77 is about average really. I think my cruising speed was about 78-79. I could bring it into the lower 80's at times but not every pitch like Folkard does. I have seen his radar gun pop at 86. That's the fastest I've ever seen.

I know a lot of people mention Ty Stofflet and Eddie Feigner who both say they threw over 100, but I don't believe it. There's no way those guys threw over 100 with old school rules of 2 feet on the rubber and not jumping but Folkard can ONLY bring it 86 while hopping 1/2 way to home. It just doesn't add up. Aside from Folkard, the hardest I ever saw someone throw was Peter Meredith (BYU coach) who was widely considered the fastest in the world during his days. He didn't have a big jump at all. If you look on YouTube for the NZ Nationals PK vs. Marist, it looks like Meredith is throwing 200 mph and the Marist team look like children swatting at flies. It's ridiculous how hard he threw. As I've said before, your best chance of hitting Folkard, Kirkpatrick, Meredith, etc. is to get a pick and hope for the best. When you know it's going up, the challenge is easier to hit the ball. Manley had more of a backswing like most females do and was easy to read from the plate but, his ball moved so much it was still hard to square up. He tried to conceal it as much as he could while keeping his backswing but, ultimately that was his kryptonite IMO.

As I write this to you guys, I'm in Dallas working with the Olympic team. I spend my days in the bullpens with all the pitchers and then throw BP to them in the afternoon. Only 2 girls (so far in the 5 days of being here) have asked me to "spin it" during BP, where they wanted pitches other than straight down the middle. Neither girl put bat to ball solidly, a few foul balls and foul tips. But nobody has squared one up, and that's me throwing 50% with just putting riseball spin on it. LET ME BE CLEAR, in another day or 2 they will have that adjusted and hit the ball hard but they all say the spin is just that much harder than that which they're used to. Most of them want nothing but straight BP to hit off, no movement.

I completely defer to you on this subject, but I have one comment and one question. First, Eddie Feigner was (allegedly) clocked at 104 mph in a testing scenario, not in a game where he might have been limited to staying within the rules (there is video on YouTube of the test). I have no idea if it made a difference, but it might have. Second, my question is whether "hopping 1/2 way to home" actually helps increase velocity, or merely cuts down the distance from pitcher's hand to home, making the elapsed time between those two points shorter, without really helping with velocity over a less elaborate style? I am skeptical about it increasing the actual speed to any degree. You are the expert, not me, so I am just asking.

 

[Hillhouse]

I completely defer to you on this subject, but I have one comment and one question. First, Eddie Feigner was (allegedly) clocked at 104 mph in a testing scenario, not in a game where he might have been limited to staying within the rules (there is video on YouTube of the test). I have no idea if it made a difference, but it might have. Second, my question is whether "hopping 1/2 way to home" actually helps increase velocity, or merely cuts down the distance from pitcher's hand to home, making the elapsed time between those two points shorter, without really helping with velocity over a less elaborate style? I am skeptical about it increasing the actual speed to any degree. You are the expert, not me, so I am just asking.

First Eddie Feigner: I think what happened, with both he and Ty Stofflet (both said to have thrown 104) is they are using the converted speed to what a baseball pitcher would throw. I've seen charts that show X mph in softball is equal to X mph in baseball. Absolutely no radar gun has ever popped 104 for a softball pitcher. Never. And even if someone stood tall with claiming he threw a softball 104, I would challenge how it was radared. Both guys were said to have thrown that fast in the early 1970's, where technology isn't what it is today.
Whether someone believes leaping/crow hopping provides extra speed or not, nobody throws faster with 2 feet on the rubber (as was the rules in the 1970's) than they do now with only 1 foot on to start. It's about momentum and leverage. I have had to pitch with both sets of rules and definitely threw harder with 1 foot on the rubber. But.... I feel my movement was better with using 2 feet.

As for question 2, I think the answer is both. Pitching power primarily comes from the legs (same as it does for hitting and throwing overhand). Pitchers that are leaping are getting a rather significant push from the rubber which adds a great deal of power. Couple that with the distance being cut from release point to home and you have both things helping reduce the hitter's reaction time.

The biggest downfall of crowhopping is it leads to "over throwing" quite often. Where a pitcher tries throwing so damn hard they lose their movement and good spin on pitches. In lower divisions of play, pitchers can dominate with speed. The higher the level, the less that speed matters. Tommy Lasorda once said "A pitcher could stand on the mound and fire a gun towards a target and eventually the hitters will time the bullet". Hyperbole aside, he's right.

I hope that helped somewhat.

 

[PDM]

First Eddie Feigner: I think what happened, with both he and Ty Stofflet (both said to have thrown 104) is they are using the converted speed to what a baseball pitcher would throw. I've seen charts that show X mph in softball is equal to X mph in baseball. Absolutely no radar gun has ever popped 104 for a softball pitcher. Never. And even if someone stood tall with claiming he threw a softball 104, I would challenge how it was radared. Both guys were said to have thrown that fast in the early 1970's, where technology isn't what it is today.
Whether someone believes leaping/crow hopping provides extra speed or not, nobody throws faster with 2 feet on the rubber (as was the rules in the 1970's) than they do now with only 1 foot on to start. It's about momentum and leverage. I have had to pitch with both sets of rules and definitely threw harder with 1 foot on the rubber. But.... I feel my movement was better with using 2 feet.

As for question 2, I think the answer is both. Pitching power primarily comes from the legs (same as it does for hitting and throwing overhand). Pitchers that are leaping are getting a rather significant push from the rubber which adds a great deal of power. Couple that with the distance being cut from release point to home and you have both things helping reduce the hitter's reaction time.

The biggest downfall of crowhopping is it leads to "over throwing" quite often. Where a pitcher tries throwing so damn hard they lose their movement and good spin on pitches. In lower divisions of play, pitchers can dominate with speed. The higher the level, the less that speed matters. Tommy Lasorda once said "A pitcher could stand on the mound and fire a gun towards a target and eventually the hitters will time the bullet". Hyperbole aside, he's right.

I hope that helped somewhat.

It did. Thanks. It does seem unlikely that even a legend could throw 15+ mph faster than the current best. I certainly agree that being able to spread the feet apart more at the start allows the pitchers to make better use of their legs. It's the big leap that some guys take that I question a bit, in terms of increasing velocity. Once both feet leave the ground, no more force is created. It actually begins to decrease. It always seemed to me that after the initial drive, it's all about how fast the arm and hand can whip around and through delivery. That seems more effectively done with a foot on the ground. I can definitely see overthrowing as a problem. Thanks very much for the feedback! Watching videos you've made have been an essential part of my education.

 

[Hillhouse]

Watching videos you've made have been an essential part of my education.

So, you're the one who saw the videos? lol. Thank you for the compliment.