Why do you think he throws so fast???

[STRIKE3]

@Hillhouse do you know him?

I posted this video a couple years ago but stil amazes me so reposting. FYI- the leap is not why he throws so fast! It helps for sure but imagine taking the leap out of it. Still solid!!!

 

[Bonesaw]

Is 125 km(77mph) really that fast for men? Thats the fastest I saw in the video. Most were a little below that.

Crow hop or not I'd imagine the best(which is not a large population sadly) are throwing around 80. I would have to think that Kirkpatrick is closer to folkard(135 kmh or 85 mph) than he is to this guy. (With No leap or crow hop).

I think an underrated aspect of the men is how much they spin it. If you are a sane person and realize that men, physically, do things at an elite level about 10-15% more than women, then you realize that they spin it 10-15% more also. Its not just 70 vs 80 mph. Its 70 vs 80 with 10-15% more spin also. I think this is why this guy looks so impressive(and he is very good!) Then you can throw in bullet spin vs real riseball spin too.

Here is a cool article about Jeremy Manley and his effect on the Ohio Uni softball team's hitting. As a pitching coach.(edit I think his title was assistant coach)

Softball: Jeremy Manley is a softball legend, helping the Ohio offense

www.alsfastball.com

Interesting fact about Manley, he was the winning pitcher in the 2005 ISC World Torunament Championship game.

 

[Hillhouse]

@Hillhouse do you know him?

I posted this video a couple years ago but stil amazes me so reposting. FYI- the leap is not why he throws so fast! It helps for sure but imagine taking the leap out of it. Still solid!!!

He looks a bit older, like me. So odds are we played against each other at the 2000 World tournament in South Africa. But, I honestly can't say for sure without knowing his name translated to English. Most of the older Japanese pitchers did not crow hop. Until recently, pitchers in Japan weren't even allowed to use rosin on their hands. Their rules were very strict.

 

[Hillhouse]

Is 125 km(77mph) really that fast for men? Thats the fastest I saw in the video. Most were a little below that.

Crow hop or not I'd imagine the best(which is not a large population sadly) are throwing around 80. I would have to think that Kirkpatrick is closer to folkard(135 kmh or 85 mph) than he is to this guy. (With No leap or crow hop).

I think an underrated aspect of the men is how much they spin it. If you are a sane person and realize that men, physically, do things at an elite level about 10-15% more than women, then you realize that they spin it 10-15% more also. Its not just 70 vs 80 mph. Its 70 vs 80 with 10-15% more spin also. I think this is why this guy looks so impressive(and he is very good!) Then you can throw in bullet spin vs real riseball spin too.

Here is a cool article about Jeremy Manley and his effect on the Ohio Uni softball team's hitting. As a pitching coach.(edit I think his title was assistant coach)

Softball: Jeremy Manley is a softball legend, helping the Ohio offense

www.alsfastball.com

Interesting fact about Manley, he was the winning pitcher in the 2005 ISC World Torunament Championship game.

Hmmm, I'd have to double check on that but, I don't think Jeremy ever won an ISC World. Remember, that is the club championships not National teams. I know he won the ISF/WBSC World in 2013 in New Zealand (while pitching for NZ) but I don't think he ever won an ISC. In fact, I think 2005 was the year he and I had a 12 inning game against each other. Get this, I had an 11 2/3 inning no-hitter that game and LOST. I'm pretty sure 2005 was in Eau Claire WI, but that doesn't take away Jeremey pitching. He was one of the best in the world for a period of time. Like me, he usually played for teams that didn't have hitting. One year he did have good hitting was 2011 (I think) and he went all the way to the championship losing to Folkard's team in the finals. That's the only ISC final I remember him in. I was unlucky enough to have 3 runner up ISC finishes in my career... never making it over the hump.

But, you are correct about speeds. 77 is about average really. I think my cruising speed was about 78-79. I could bring it into the lower 80's at times but not every pitch like Folkard does. I have seen his radar gun pop at 86. That's the fastest I've ever seen.

I know a lot of people mention Ty Stofflet and Eddie Feigner who both say they threw over 100, but I don't believe it. There's no way those guys threw over 100 with old school rules of 2 feet on the rubber and not jumping but Folkard can ONLY bring it 86 while hopping 1/2 way to home. It just doesn't add up. Aside from Folkard, the hardest I ever saw someone throw was Peter Meredith (BYU coach) who was widely considered the fastest in the world during his days. He didn't have a big jump at all. If you look on YouTube for the NZ Nationals PK vs. Marist, it looks like Meredith is throwing 200 mph and the Marist team look like children swatting at flies. It's ridiculous how hard he threw. As I've said before, your best chance of hitting Folkard, Kirkpatrick, Meredith, etc. is to get a pick and hope for the best. When you know it's going up, the challenge is easier to hit the ball. Manley had more of a backswing like most females do and was easy to read from the plate but, his ball moved so much it was still hard to square up. He tried to conceal it as much as he could while keeping his backswing but, ultimately that was his kryptonite IMO.

As I write this to you guys, I'm in Dallas working with the Olympic team. I spend my days in the bullpens with all the pitchers and then throw BP to them in the afternoon. Only 2 girls (so far in the 5 days of being here) have asked me to "spin it" during BP, where they wanted pitches other than straight down the middle. Neither girl put bat to ball solidly, a few foul balls and foul tips. But nobody has squared one up, and that's me throwing 50% with just putting riseball spin on it. LET ME BE CLEAR, in another day or 2 they will have that adjusted and hit the ball hard but they all say the spin is just that much harder than that which they're used to. Most of them want nothing but straight BP to hit off, no movement.

 

[STRIKE3]

Is 125 km(77mph) really that fast for men? Thats the fastest I saw in the video. Most were a little below that.

Crow hop or not I'd imagine the best(which is not a large population sadly) are throwing around 80. I would have to think that Kirkpatrick is closer to folkard(135 kmh or 85 mph) than he is to this guy. (With No leap or crow hop).

I think an underrated aspect of the men is how much they spin it. If you are a sane person and realize that men, physically, do things at an elite level about 10-15% more than women, then you realize that they spin it 10-15% more also. Its not just 70 vs 80 mph. Its 70 vs 80 with 10-15% more spin also. I think this is why this guy looks so impressive(and he is very good!) Then you can throw in bullet spin vs real riseball spin too.

Here is a cool article about Jeremy Manley and his effect on the Ohio Uni softball team's hitting. As a pitching coach.(edit I think his title was assistant coach)

Softball: Jeremy Manley is a softball legend, helping the Ohio offense

www.alsfastball.com

Interesting fact about Manley, he was the winning pitcher in the 2005 ISC World Torunament Championship game.

Good points here Bonesaw! Yes, you are right regarding men and I am so used to watching girls/ladies pitch that the 77 mph he throws still blows me away. It's a humming!! I think it is not only the speed that is impressive but the mechanics over there for me. I have about a million Japanese pitching videos bookmarked and study them regulary. I will post more on this in a bit but for some reason they amaze me.

Good post on Manley and will check it out in depth!

Happy Super Bowl Sunday and go BUCS!!!!!

S3

 

[STRIKE3]

Hmmm, I'd have to double check on that but, I don't think Jeremy ever won an ISC World. Remember, that is the club championships not National teams. I know he won the ISF/WBSC World in 2013 in New Zealand (while pitching for NZ) but I don't think he ever won an ISC. In fact, I think 2005 was the year he and I had a 12 inning game against each other. Get this, I had an 11 2/3 inning no-hitter that game and LOST. I'm pretty sure 2005 was in Eau Claire WI, but that doesn't take away Jeremey pitching. He was one of the best in the world for a period of time. Like me, he usually played for teams that didn't have hitting. One year he did have good hitting was 2011 (I think) and he went all the way to the championship losing to Folkard's team in the finals. That's the only ISC final I remember him in. I was unlucky enough to have 3 runner up ISC finishes in my career... never making it over the hump.

But, you are correct about speeds. 77 is about average really. I think my cruising speed was about 78-79. I could bring it into the lower 80's at times but not every pitch like Folkard does. I have seen his radar gun pop at 86. That's the fastest I've ever seen.

I know a lot of people mention Ty Stofflet and Eddie Feigner who both say they threw over 100, but I don't believe it. There's no way those guys threw over 100 with old school rules of 2 feet on the rubber and not jumping but Folkard can ONLY bring it 86 while hopping 1/2 way to home. It just doesn't add up. Aside from Folkard, the hardest I ever saw someone throw was Peter Meredith (BYU coach) who was widely considered the fastest in the world during his days. He didn't have a big jump at all. If you look on YouTube for the NZ Nationals PK vs. Marist, it looks like Meredith is throwing 200 mph and the Marist team look like children swatting at flies. It's ridiculous how hard he threw. As I've said before, your best chance of hitting Folkard, Kirkpatrick, Meredith, etc. is to get a pick and hope for the best. When you know it's going up, the challenge is easier to hit the ball. Manley had more of a backswing like most females do and was easy to read from the plate but, his ball moved so much it was still hard to square up. He tried to conceal it as much as he could while keeping his backswing but, ultimately that was his kryptonite IMO.

As I write this to you guys, I'm in Dallas working with the Olympic team. I spend my days in the bullpens with all the pitchers and then throw BP to them in the afternoon. Only 2 girls (so far in the 5 days of being here) have asked me to "spin it" during BP, where they wanted pitches other than straight down the middle. Neither girl put bat to ball solidly, a few foul balls and foul tips. But nobody has squared one up, and that's me throwing 50% with just putting riseball spin on it. LET ME BE CLEAR, in another day or 2 they will have that adjusted and hit the ball hard but they all say the spin is just that much harder than that which they're used to. Most of them want nothing but straight BP to hit off, no movement.

Thanks for the feedback Bill as always. About a pandemic ago I think I offered you and @sluggers a steak dinner with cold brew on your next trip to Dallas. Sorry I missed that you were here this time. When the smoke clears and the world is back to normal please hit me up on your next trip and we will do it.

S3

 

[Bonesaw]

@Hillhouse Haha ya that 2005 game vs you was the one I was trying to reference. You had mentioned it in another thread a few weeks/months ago. I was just trying to get a jab in there

And @STRIKE3 , in my first post it might have sounded a little dismissive of the player in your video. He is/was obviously a very good pitcher. I guess I was trying to ask if 77 is average for a top tier mens pitcher if that makes any sense. And thanks for sharing that video!

 

[sluggers]

@Hillhouse where is the olympic team working out?

 

[STRIKE3]

@Hillhouse Haha ya that 2005 game vs you was the one I was trying to reference. You had mentioned it in another thread a few weeks/months ago. I was just trying to get a jab in there

And @STRIKE3 , in my first post it might have sounded a little dismissive of the player in your video. He is/was obviously a very good pitcher. I guess I was trying to ask if 77 is average for a top tier mens pitcher if that makes any sense. And thanks for sharing that video!

Not dismissive at all @Bonesaw. I think the video behind the plate with the ball coming in is amazing. Rarely do you get to see that view unless you are catching the pitcher. Pretty cool!

 

[Hillhouse]

@Hillhouse where is the olympic team working out?

Well, the daily work outs are at the Texas Rangers Youth Facility, I have no idea where that is but it's not an overly nice neighborhood. It's an all turf field, they're practicing on a baseball field with no fixed bases and no rubbers fixed into the ground on the field or bullpens. I'm not sure why they picked this place but I'm not in charge of logistics. We are staying up near the Galleria mall area at some Marriot Residence place. It's a solid 20 min drive from hotel to ballpark. Yesterday we went to the Texas Glory facility (McKinney?) and they did a scrimmage until they were too cold and cancelled. Tomorrow we're back at the Rangers facility, fans are not allowed (although I'm not sure what they'd do if someone showed up and just sat in the bleachers). The team isn't allowed to interact with anyone for autographs, pics, etc. And there's talk that this weekend's 3 game set vs. Mexico will be cancelled due to dangerously low temps. They're calling for temps in the 30's here in Dallas which is just too low for softball. I thought yesterday was too low also but they did about 5 innings... while I sat in my rental car!!