Turning the barrel and launch position

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Sep 17, 2009
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"Drifting" seems like a reasonable term... As soon as the ball leaves the pitcher's hand, the hitter is immediately starting to process information. That process continues throughout much of the swing. Notice the very subtle differences between these two clips. Personally, I do not see any "slop" and I definitely don't see "DBSF".

4Z8nAQu.gif

During this move-out I don't see 'drift' I see *tip* (or in less obvious tip cases, I see or feel *pressure*) which is critical PART of using the hands to work the handle to turn the barrel, ie you don't just TTB in one direction you ideally tip and (reverse it) rip, all around a tight hand pivot point. I think slowing the video down and looking for a forward drift or independent-of-the-hands elbow slot is really working hard to create a counter-narrative to TTB and missing the main point -- the hands are live, independent and working the barrel as quickly and tightly as possible to turn the barrel behind the ball. I work elbows as a 'side-teach' -- not at all if they are working correctly, a little bit of instruction if they get lost on certain pitch locations such as high. But the action and sensor is at the hands....at least IMHO (and that's just talking about TTB as an isolated move, which it isn't, it's blended with coil and stretch and ultimately *GO*).
 
May 30, 2013
1,442
83
Binghamton, NY
"Drifting" seems like a reasonable term... As soon as the ball leaves the pitcher's hand, the hitter is immediately starting to process information. That process continues throughout much of the swing. Notice the very subtle differences between these two clips. Personally, I do not see any "slop" and I definitely don't see "DBSF".

4Z8nAQu.gif
somehow this thread morphed from Gurrero JR to Cabrera?

Jr’s early swing phase, the barrel “drifts” from more vertical to more horizontal. Miguel’s early phase is more stsying vertical and tip/rip.

but my earlier comments were about Jr’s
 
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Sep 17, 2009
1,636
83
somehow this thread morphed from Gurrero JR to Cabrera?

Jr’s early swing phase, the barrel “drifts” from more vertical to more horizontal. Miguel’s early phase is more stsying vertical and tip/rip.

but my earlier comments were about Jr’s

very fair, I didn't know how to address both hitters without overcomplicating my response, though I did have a parenthesis that even without a tip there's likely hand pressure toward the pitcher before it is reversed as part of TTB....anyway, I do think that drifting and slotting are not what's happening -- or not what hitters should be thinking about happening and actively trying to execute. I think slow-mo video can sometimes disguise the very ACTIVE actions that are being taken under the hood and place the analysis emphasis on the wrong thing....again, IMO....
 
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
very fair, I didn't know how to address both hitters without overcomplicating my response, though I did have a parenthesis that even without a tip there's likely hand pressure toward the pitcher before it is reversed as part of TTB....anyway, I do think that drifting and slotting are not what's happening -- or not what hitters should be thinking about happening and actively trying to execute. I think slow-mo video can sometimes disguise the very ACTIVE actions that are being taken under the hood and place the analysis emphasis on the wrong thing....again, IMO....

You completely misunderstood what I was referring to as drift. But that's okay. I did a poor job of explaining it. Your comment above concerning hand pressure in different directions is essentially the point I was trying to get across. Same thing... different words...
 
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
somehow this thread morphed from Gurrero JR to Cabrera?

Jr’s early swing phase, the barrel “drifts” from more vertical to more horizontal. Miguel’s early phase is more stsying vertical and tip/rip.

but my earlier comments were about Jr’s

I was agreeing with you... whether the bat remains vertical or gets more of a traditional running start, the process is more active as RichK stated.... Back to the cheap seats guys. Enjoy the discussion.
 
Jan 6, 2009
6,627
113
Chehalis, Wa
giphy.gif


How about this swing? I no longer believe in the slo-motion myth that it's not what is happening. When in fact it's the truth and it blows some peoples belief system out the window. The truth is hard to take for some people who have a stake in creating their own belief system.
 
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
giphy.gif


How about this swing? I no longer believe in the slo-motion myth that it's not what is happening. When in fact it's the truth and it blows some peoples belief system out the window. The truth is hard to take for some people who have a stake in creating their own belief system.

What about this clip catches your eye? I see a good example of TTB behind a corner.
 
Jan 6, 2009
6,627
113
Chehalis, Wa
FP26

It's excellent for TTB, not so much for just snapping the barrel rearward. The swing happens more like Mankin describes.

Mankin talks about how the top hand circles around. Hand rotational point (my view) and changing the direction of the knob (my view). Sets up the oar lock effect.
 
Last edited:
Jul 16, 2013
4,659
113
Pennsylvania
FP26

It's excellent for TTB, not so much for just snapping the barrel rearward. The swing happens more like Mankin describes.

Apparently our understanding of what rearward means is a little different. I just see it as a phrase to illustrate acceleration that occurs behind the hitter instead of late acceleration beside or in front. Like most other terms it can be overbaked.
 
Sep 17, 2009
1,636
83
You completely misunderstood what I was referring to as drift. But that's okay. I did a poor job of explaining it. Your comment above concerning hand pressure in different directions is essentially the point I was trying to get across. Same thing... different words...
Right. I wasn't disagreeing with your take per se, just grabbing your GIFs
 

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