O'Leary, Cshilt,Wellphyt,FiveFrameSwing, other hitting "experts"

[SBFAMILY]

I agree with my Friend Chris. No one is an expert , but you should keep an open mind and learn from many sources. I always ask questions from many sources. I work clinics for Carrier an Bustos. I have go to as many clinics as possible. We have a good one coming up in Ohio, Candrea, Carrier, Slaught, Patkau, Deganais all on Dec. 18. You go and get ideas from the best. Then it depends on your teaching ability and how you can relate it to your students.

11-6 we have Kobota, Hillhouse, Candrea , and Hartwig. So we feel lucky to learn from some of the best.

 

[theaddition]

Correct. I was probably not as clear as I should have been. It is possible to start the swing (launch) and stop it in what looks like the bat lag position by putting the brakes on.

The actual bat lag position is a transition from launch to contact.

Of course that all depends on your definition of the terms.

There is a clip of posada, on the right side of the clip he swings and the left of the clip is a check swing.
There clip is very enlightening.
I have it but I can't post any clips at this site.
If someone has it, can you post it?

BD

 

[tom.guerry]

nyman pcrw code:

What is PCR(W)??



"Simplicity of the swing comes from understanding that a high-level swing is nothing more than making sure that the mass of the bat (sweet spot) travels in a plane of rotation parallel to a plane that is “scribed out” by a rod or stick passing through both shoulders extending in the same direction as would be the bat passing over home plate."

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

For example, one’s term of “coil” is another’s term of “setting posture.” Identical video is used.

CB, I could believe this. There is a school of thought that dynamically establishing posture, with timing, can assist a hitter in coiling into their rear hip without relying on using the momentum of their upper body to provide the coiling action. In other words, it can be used to assist with obtaining the sequence of Coil, Stretch & Swing .... as opposed to Stretching to obtain the Coil & then swinging. Think in terms of someone loading their upper body so as to coil into their rear hip ... not what you want.

Here's an example of someone setting their posture while coiling ...

This leaves the hitter in a good position to perform their 'stretch' prior to launching their swing.

 

[RichK]

I agree with my Friend Chris. No one is an expert , but you should keep an open mind and learn from many sources. I always ask questions from many sources. I work clinics for Carrier an Bustos. I have go to as many clinics as possible. We have a good one coming up in Ohio, Candrea, Carrier, Slaught, Patkau, Deganais all on Dec. 18. You go and get ideas from the best. Then it depends on your teaching ability and how you can relate it to your students.

11-6 we have Kobota, Hillhouse, Candrea , and Hartwig. So we feel lucky to learn from some of the best.

So who is putting those clinics together in Ohio? Sound awesome. I've been to National Fastpitch Clinics here in the Chicago area, which are great but oddly are like a convention with speakers on a stage with Powerpoints and a big audience in chairs at tables. The speakers do tend to move around, demonstrate etc...but it's a big group and not in a gym but a convention room.

Just curious. tks.

 

[cshilt]

So who is putting those clinics together in Ohio? Sound awesome. I've been to National Fastpitch Clinics here in the Chicago area, which are great but oddly are like a convention with speakers on a stage with Powerpoints and a big audience in chairs at tables. The speakers do tend to move around, demonstrate etc...but it's a big group and not in a gym but a convention room.

Just curious. tks.

Crystl Bustos Howard Carrier and Micaela Minner in Cincinnati - OFC - Ohio Fastpitch Connection

MASH Hitting clinic-Slaught, Carrier, Deganais, Paetkau - OFC - Ohio Fastpitch Connection

Defenive clinic-Mike Candrea, Hillhouse, Kobata, Hartwig - OFC - Ohio Fastpitch Connection

New England Catcher's Camp-Cincinnati, OH - OFC - Ohio Fastpitch Connection

 

[Wellphyt]

Wellphyt - your post above isn't very specific, if I can paraphrase: "emulate MLB hitter's swings and the softball swing mechanics are the same as baseball"

1. Balanced stance with feet slightly further than shoulder width apart. Weight slightly on inside of feet. I use the cue "Sit" to convey my idea of the correct posture. Feet laterally separated approximately 2" with the back foot closer to home plate than the front foot. Feet point towards plate - no duck feet.
2. Hands no higher than the shoulders. Forearms form a triangle when looking down through them.
3. Barrel vertical to 45 degrees. (Style choice)
4. Knocking knuckles of top hand line up between top knuckles and knocking knuckles of bottom hand. Bat held in fingers of top hand and further back in bottom hand.
5. When front foot is lifted to stride (approximately 4" stride), coil against rear leg by screwing rear foot clockwise (RHB) against the ground. Rear leg straightens/firms up as front foot picks up.
6. During the stride the hands load back to armpit height by internal rotation to create stretch.
7. Toe touch with front foot open approximately 45 degrees. The start of separation. Front leg slightly flexed for balance.
8. Front heel drops, initiating the opening of the hips. Back knee hinges.
9. Back elbow slots by external rotation (overhand throw motion). Front elbow gets up off the letters by flexion and internal rotation. This move helps to maximize the separation of the upper and lower torso.
10. Shoulders laterally tilt.
11. Upper torso begins to turn.
12. 9, 10 and 11 happen virtually simultaneously and appear as one seamless move.
13. Back knee begins turning in (no "squishing the bug") as the hips begin to unwind from the coil.
14. The degree of shoulder tilt is dependent on pitch location - less on high pitches; more on low pitches. Front elbow is used as a heads-up-display to fine tune shoulder tilt.
15. Front knee begins to firm/lock as hands come forward. Top hand works "underneath" by supination. Cues such as "scoop sand" or "throw the barrel" can help convey this move.
16. Belly button facing pitcher on pitches middle-half in; not as much on pitches away.
17. Bat-head parallel to ground in beginning phase, but quickly begins working below hands as swing progresses toward contact. Hands palm up -palm down at contact. Bat is on pitch plane at contact
18. Hitter "on" or "behind" axis. (Dependent on pitch location: less on high pitches; more on low pitches.) No lunging.
19. Eyes level and head slightly down to straight ahead. (Not watching the ball hit the bat.)
20. Front knee immediately releases once contact is made to preserve balance.
21. Front foot eventually points at pitcher due to rotational momentum around the hitter's axis and weight goes to the outside of the front foot.
22. Extension. "Power V" out in front of the hitter. Will vary depending on pitch location.
23. Wrists do not roll until well after contact.
24. Arms fully extend through contact.
25. Position of the hands in the follow-through depends on contact location (higher on low pitches; lower on high pitches).

I believe in the following principles regarding the hands:
1. Hand-Pivot-Point
2. Top Hand is the primary power source getting the swing initiated and the front hand helps to guide the power.

I believe the cue coil - stretch - Separate/swing is a good way to help kids create a mental image of a well sequenced swing.

I believe the overhand throw can help kids learn the correct sequence and sync.

If you need me to get more specific than this let me know.

 

[cshilt]

Wellphyt, thanks for your post. To me, some of your descriptions are confusing as you're using kinesiology articuation terms, but some of them don't marry up to what I think they should. I'm sure it is my own shortcoming.

These are the articulations I'm familiar with: Joint Articulations and Movements

So, for example, when you say "the elbow slots by external rotation" it confuses me as the elbow joint either flexes (bringing forearm toward upper arm) or extends (bringing forearm away from upper arm). Elbow Articulations

Can you help me out?

 

[Wellphyt]

Wellphyt, thanks for your post. To me, some of your descriptions are confusing as you're using kinesiology articuation terms, but some of them don't marry up to what I think they should. I'm sure it is my own shortcoming.

These are the articulations I'm familiar with: Joint Articulations and Movements

So, for example, when you say "the elbow slots by external rotation" it confuses me as the elbow joint either flexes (bringing forearm toward upper arm) or extends (bringing forearm away from upper arm). Elbow Articulations

Can you help me out?

The upper arm (humerus) externally rotates. It's actually a combination move of external rotation and ADduction of the upper arm, but IMO the controlling movement is external rotation. Most kids simple ADduct the upper arm to slot, which produces a less desirable barrel path.

 

[cshilt]

Fantastic. That is much clearer. There are a few others I need clarified if you have the time.

6. During the stride the hands load back to armpit height by internal rotation to create stretch.

What is internally rotating? The shoulders? The torso?

8. Front heel drops, initiating the opening of the hips. Back knee hinges.

I assume by "hinges" you mean that the knee flexes (moving the lower leg toward the back of the thigh).

10. Shoulders laterally tilt.

I take lateral to mean from left to right, or right to left. I don't think this is what you mean. Rear shoulder dips (slightly)?

15. Front knee begins to firm/lock as hands come forward. Top hand works "underneath" by supination. Cues such as "scoop sand" or "throw the barrel" can help convey this move.

The top hand (forearm) suplinates? Is the bottom hand (forearm) pronating then?