Elite level pitcher that doesnt use I/R? Definately not I/R. BM please explain? Lol!

[cuzmail]

DD and I sat thru a Jennie Finch clinic a couple of years ago. She taught HE with a step in the demonstration and even threw some pitches that way too, but we all know when Jennie pitches in a game that isn't what she does at all. Maybe this player does the same thing.

 

[cuzmail]

Jenny throws mostly riseballs (some screwballs, too), so she does not HE those, of course, but her fastball is all HE. She is not as dumb as everyone makes her out to be. The HE may be wrong, but she does practice what she preaches on it.

I completely disagree with this. She does not practice what she teaches. We love Jennie too, but that doesn't mean we don't realize what is happening. In her demos she teaches a completely different release and arm pattern that what she actually does in a live competitive pitch. She will demo pitches with HE in a clinic setting, but she doesn't in a game setting.

In the video of Jennie that I have watched she pitches like all the other top level pitchers. However at the end of her pitch she makes a huge extra effort to force her hand from the left hip region back up to the right shoulder. To the unknowing and those not paying attention, it may appear the she uses HE, but she doesn't she just finishes that way. It all happens quickly.

 

[cuzmail]

That's because she does not throw fastballs in games. Duh.If you saw her when younger, she did throw more fastballs.

Duh? You trying to take a position of superiority here and condescend to anyone who doesn't agree? I still think you are wrong.

You could make those two generic fastball statements above about any pitcher in the country.

 

[SoGASoftball]

I have seen many pitchers use IR naturally even though they are taught HE. I had the fortunate experience of talking with several D1 pitchers at the Mary Nutter tournament in Palm Springs last winter, and all of them were taught HE. None of them had ever heard of IR even though they clearly use it naturally.

It seems that finding an instructor (which is very difficult) that starts with IR would be logical, but it may not "damage" our DD's chances of being a competitive pitcher if you can't find one.

 

[Perfect Circle]

I have seen many pitchers use IR naturally even though they are taught HE. I had the fortunate experience of talking with several D1 pitchers at the Mary Nutter tournament in Palm Springs last winter, and all of them were taught HE. None of them had ever heard of IR even though they clearly use it naturally.

It seems that finding an instructor (which is very difficult) that starts with IR would be logical, but it may not "damage" our DD's chances of being a competitive pitcher if you can't find one.

What the common problem is to both schools of thought is the local reality.... There are lotz of common people who think your lesson money is better spent on their fundraisers... or helping support the closest facility...& the "pro" in the house... irregardless of either technique ... times it by 2 if you have an athlete....

 

[Jojo]

I have a handout that I give to all my new students, about what I teach and why I teach. Basically about teaching what the elite players do.
I have a disadvantage because every PC around here teaches push down/pull up/Hello elbow, so parents are usually concerned that I'm teaching their DD's some "weird" concept. There are even PC's here that swear every elite pitcher pitches with Push down/pull up/hello elbow and probably think this due to beginners pitching videos.

In my handout I have still shots of Stacy Nelson, Kenzie Fowler, Jenny Finch, Amanda Scarborough all giving lessons using the push down/pull up/hello elbow methods. It's hard to argue with great pitchers teaching something you are against.
But alongside the still shots, I show the motion shots of these pitchers actually pitching showing they are not pitching the same way they are demonstrating.

 

[MountieSB]

This was the same conversation about hitting with "linear" vs. "rotational" hitting years ago. What settled the argument was:
1. A change in terminology ("high-level pattern") and
2. Video evidence to debunk the myths of both sides of the argument.

I have no doubt pitching terminology will evolve to "high-level pitching pattern" and in time enough video evidence will debunk the "hand behind the ball at 9:00" and "HE" myths.

 

[BoardMember]

Quite simply, Rick and Java hit the nail on the head........Nelson is a SCREWBALL pitcher........She THROWS WITH I/R........But finishes thumb out to enhance side spin.........

You guys are sure saving me a lot of typing.......THX!!!

 

[Rick Pauly]

It's our mission in life......

Quite simply, Rick and Java hit the nail on the head........Nelson is a SCREWBALL pitcher........She THROWS WITH I/R........But finishes thumb out to enhance side spin.........

You guys are sure saving me a lot of typing.......THX!!!

 

[Left Hook]

I have a handout that I give to all my new students, about what I teach and why I teach. Basically about teaching what the elite players do.
I have a disadvantage because every PC around here teaches push down/pull up/Hello elbow, so parents are usually concerned that I'm teaching their DD's some "weird" concept. There are even PC's here that swear every elite pitcher pitches with Push down/pull up/hello elbow and probably think this due to beginners pitching videos.

In my handout I have still shots of Stacy Nelson, Kenzie Fowler, Jenny Finch, Amanda Scarborough all giving lessons using the push down/pull up/hello elbow methods. It's hard to argue with great pitchers teaching something you are against.
But alongside the still shots, I show the motion shots of these pitchers actually pitching showing they are not pitching the same way they are demonstrating.

Amanda s teaches HE? Show her students her power drive video talk about IR? How can she not know that? I don't understand this at all.. What's the reason?