twist in motion?

[Ken B]

Hillhouse does not teach the back arm swing and he does not teach the roll over drop. These two bad habits are the 1st things Bill corrects and changes. As far as the arms helping with the leg push, it is both arms go forward together with the ball hand in the glove.
I don't agree that the power thrust and long stride is as good as the push and drag where the ball travels a longer distance with more movement than a shorter distance with more speed. Movement is harder to hit than speed and a hitter in front of the plate sees the ball and hits the ball before the movement. They hitter that stands behind the plate hits the ball with movement and the ball goes where the pitcher wants the ball to go. Female FP from 43' at 70mph is nothing like male fastpitch from 46' at 84mph.
Who can you name that is better than Thomas and the Renfroe sisters, in today's female game? Not talking about Thomas having to throw three games over the weekend. There is a difference in a pitcher and a big thrower.

I can't speak for Coach Hillhouse, but I believe he would advocate for a strong drive and using the hands to help make that drive more efficient. He's very clear that the hands do not need to separate to be able to contribute to an efficient drive. I can't think of anyone who would say that an open armswing is a must-do. I do think that getting closer to the batter to deliver a pitch in the most effecient manner possible is an advantage. Using the arms, whether using an open or closed swing, helps to that end.

Better than Thomas or the Renfroe sisters? I guess it depends on the criteria. In terms of who will lead their teams to the top three? I've got:
Toss up for the top two:
-Oklahoma's Gascoigne and Ricketts
-Arizona St's Popescque and Escobedo
and a five-way tie for 3rd with Mizzou, Texas, Bama and I forgot Oregon and Florida earlier. Tennessee is also a favorite.

Put with equal teams and perfect health, there's several pitchers I think could lead teams effectively--each with their own strengths.

 

[starsnuffer]

Eh, Abbott and Osterman are still pitching. Abbott throws consistently in the high 70s and learned an effective changeup AFTER her college and Olympic experience. Osterman continues to baffle the best batters coming out of the amateur college ranks, although she's had some bicep related health issues lately.

Sadly, there's not much future for pitchers after college, so I'm not sure we'll see kids have the opportunity to develop from "good" college pitchers to awesome fastpitch pitchers like these two ladies have. Hopefully I'm proven wrong. I just don't think there is a valid comparison between the college level and the elite level pitchers.

-W

 

[Ken B]

Have Ueno and Mowatt retired?

 

[starsnuffer]

Have Ueno and Mowatt retired?

Mowatt was physically destroyed in last college series she played. She made some attempt to play NPF but has mostly been more of a pretty face then an effective pitcher. She does have the "Mowatt lines" as her legacy though.

I'm not sure if Ueno is still pitching or not. I know she was playing a year ago in the Japanese professional league (Abbott and Osterman pitch there as well, they make way more money in Japan then NPF). Last team she played for was Renesas Takasaki, I'm not sure if she's still there or not or if she's still involved in the National team.

-W

 

[halskinner]

Hal , I started out throwing sling shot at an early age. Harvey Sterkel was a neighbor and my Idol. Then Joe Lynch came to town and I started the windmill in 69 while I was a member of the All Navy Team out of the Sub base in Norfolk for three years 69 70 and 71. We called it rock and fire or rythume and stride. I did get to pitch with Aurora Home Savings in 73 with Sterkel, Brubaker and Carlson. There were a few of the old Sealmaster players still playing for Home. Barron Christenson and Hurtt. In 72 I pitched with a team out of Columbus Ohio. We won the State beating Ray Miller with Hamelton. We got beat in the Ashland regionals by Ann Arbor who went to the nationals. In 74 I played for a team in Sunnyvale, Calif. Aurora didn't need me. I got beat in the regionals by Balswick and Santa Rosa. They went on that year winning the nationals beating Home in the finals. Long story I said enough.

Your name is SO familiar. I played A div and my team from Modest, Joaquin Construction, won the 79 A nationals and I got the MV pitcher trophy. Got 5 offers to play for Major A teams the next year but turned them down. Quit law enforcement to play in 79, got my job back in 80 and could not keep a schedule they needed. Got in a multiple roll over accident in 86, took me out of competition, too many injuries.

Did you pitch in any A tournies around NorCaal in 78 or 79? We had a few tournies that were A and A-major. Like 2 tournaments going on at the same time in the same complex, usually Stockton. I would have stood out, 6'6", 250 and threw ridiculously fast with a riseball that was a killer.

 

[1fingeredknuckler]

Being the Sealmasters entered the discussion, i saw them in a DH in Wisconsin probably in the 60's they had a title then of US CHAMPS or better, do any of you remember them playing a DH then, ? I know who pitched for the Madison teams, but not the Seals, The games were like 2-1, 1-0 and i think a split. Best pitching at that time i ever saw, i was not in the games, spectator.

 

[X pitcher]

Eh, Abbott and Osterman are still pitching. Abbott throws consistently in the high 70s and learned an effective changeup AFTER her college and Olympic experience. Osterman continues to baffle the best batters coming out of the amateur college ranks, although she's had some bicep related health issues lately.

Sadly, there's not much future for pitchers after college, so I'm not sure we'll see kids have the opportunity to develop from "good" college pitchers to awesome fastpitch pitchers like these two ladies have. Hopefully I'm proven wrong. I just don't think there is a valid comparison between the college level and the elite level pitchers.

-W

That's what I'm trying to say is the only real elite College pitchers,not throwers are Chelsea Thomas of Mizzou and Ivy and Ellen Renfroe of Tenn. The rest are just big throwers with mainly speed and no real idea of what they are doing. That includes Traina Ricketts. and Dallas E JMHO

 

[X pitcher]

Have Ueno and Mowatt retired?

Mowatt is coaching the College where her younger sister is now playing.It's a smaller Baptist school around LA or just north of...we are friends on FB. Ueno was with Japan last summer at the ISF WT in Canada. Japan and Ueno beat Team USA in the 11th inning of the tie breaker where they put a runner on 2nd base...

 

[X pitcher]

Your name is SO familiar. I played A div and my team from Modest, Joaquin Construction, won the 79 A nationals and I got the MV pitcher trophy. Got 5 offers to play for Major A teams the next year but turned them down. Quit law enforcement to play in 79, got my job back in 80 and could not keep a schedule they needed. Got in a multiple roll over accident in 86, took me out of competition, too many injuries.

Did you pitch in any A tournies around NorCaal in 78 or 79? We had a few tournies that were A and A-major. Like 2 tournaments going on at the same time in the same complex, usually Stockton. I would have stood out, 6'6", 250 and threw ridiculously fast with a riseball that was a killer.

No I played part of a season in Oxnard for the Cammarillo Kings in the WSC ISC in 76 and 77 I was in Logan WVA ISC. I was done in 78 I had enough fun watching team mates pop out and strike out trying for the fense, when all we needed was a ball in play. I went on to master the Frisbee and played Disc Golf fishing and camping for my own enjoyment.

 

[X pitcher]

Being the Sealmasters entered the discussion, i saw them in a DH in Wisconsin probably in the 60's they had a title then of US CHAMPS or better, do any of you remember them playing a DH then, ? I know who pitched for the Madison teams, but not the Seals, The games were like 2-1, 1-0 and i think a split. Best pitching at that time i ever saw, i was not in the games, spectator.

Sealmasters sponsor, SA ball Bearings was bought by Borg Werner and then Home Savings took over the Sponsorship in 72. Pitchers were Sterkel Lynch and Richard in the late 60s. Seals won the ASA nationals 4 times and the ISF WT 2times, Home took 2nd 4 years in a row at the ASA nationals starting in 1974 to 77. In 1980 Aurora Home Savings won the ISC WT. Now a realator, Dolan and Murphy has been sponsoring the Aurora team, but they are ranked ~ 20 out of 40 teams in thew ISC. I pitched for Home in 73 with Sterkel Brubaker and Carlson. I wasn't needed. I was young 24 Sterkel and Brubaker were both 39 and Carlson was late 20s.