Should batter hit down on ball?

[Mark H]

The difference in pitch path angle is in the single digits in terms of degrees. Not enough to talk about. In MLB the variation between swing plane angles between an Edmonds with a lot of up angle to the swing plane vs some others shows much greater variation than the difference between the pitch path angle of bb vs fp.

We could have a whole 'nuther argument about the importance of matching swing plane to pitch path angle some other time.

 

[calgofo]

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We could have a whole 'nuther argument about the importance of matching swing plane to pitch path angle some other time.

Yep. I always enjoy those. Such technical detail is brought out of the shadows and the questioning of the legitimacy/parentage of one poster by another is always fun as well.

 

[Wellphyt]

According to Epstein, you want to "swing on the same plane as the pitch". Wouldn't the swing plane for softball be more level to the ground than say BB, in which the ball is released higher (head high vs hip high)? Does this "fact" make a difference in the hitting instruction for girls?

The swing plane will depend on the pitch. For instance, a hitter will not have a lot of success swinging level to the ground on a peel drop thrown low in the zone. However, if they get a riseball thrown at the letters, they will need to level out their swing some to get on top of it.

My point is that when it comes to the trajectory of the pitch, there are more factors to consider than the release point. IMO, if the girls are properly taught how to get on plane, they will be able to figure out the correct bat angle as they gain experience in the batters box.

In response to the original post; I would say, unless you're a slap hitter, swinging down is always a bad idea. Swinging down predisposes the body to come forward resulting in lunging. It also will result in a short hitting zone with very little margine for error. Swinging down makes it a lot harder for the hitter to hit the ball square.

However some coaches in FP still believe any ball hit in the air is taboo. They want their hitters to keep the ball on the ground. That strategy can work at the younger ages. But as the girls get older, bigger, stronger and faster; it gets harder and harder to hit the ball on the ground through the infield. I don't know about FP, but in MLB, 88% of ground balls are outs. I think a better strategy is to try and hit line drives over the infielder's heads. I tell my daughter to try and hit everything in the air. Preferably line drives.

 

[ifubuildit]

Amy

Is the good parents thing the same as picking out the players with pretty moms? I have known coaches who's main critera for picking their players was that.

 

[Fastpitch Trainer]

Swinging down.....I think most people on this board would be suprised at how often that is still taught at Major programs at D1 schools. I say suprised, becuase most on here are doing their own research, or trying to find their beliefs on the swing. Meaning, we ruled out the swing down cue a while back.

I just posted pictures on my website (Home Page) with a 7th grade FP student of mine, and Manny Ramirez. The angle of the ball to get in the zone, yes, different. The actual angle of the ball in the zone, VERY similar.

I posted these pictures, because I was recently in a conversation with someone who claimed that girls can't use the MLB swing, like they're not capable, because it works for a certain size athlete. So I thought I'd show them a 7th grader who is following the pattern very well. My point was, if you're saying this kid needs to conform to a more suited female swing, then you're telling me that Manny couldn't hit in FP with his swing. Hopefully they get the point after seeing the pics.

Mark Mulvany

 

[obbay]

Mark- great series of photos!

 

[SBFAMILY]

Dana, I like that method, but it would really get me in hot water! I would comment about swinging down on the ball, but my dd does, because she slaps 50% of the time. I bet those type of hitters or coaches have never used a T stacker or know how to use one..

 

[Mark H]

The swing plane will depend on the pitch. For instance, a hitter will not have a lot of success swinging level to the ground on a peel drop thrown low in the zone. However, if they get a riseball thrown at the letters, they will need to level out their swing some to get on top of it..

http://home.mindspring.com/~rmk/ULL0001.mpg

Photo 2 of 16, ULL vs. UNT

I would say in both cases, low and high, the hitter figured out how to rotate the shoulders in a plane that allowed her to swing the bat parallel to the shoulder rotation plane. Certainly the swing on the high pitch was not in plane with pitch path but rather was a swing aimed to a certain point and time in space. Both had in common though, swinging the bat in a plane about parallel to the shoulder rotation plane.

I too try to teach more of a level to the ground swing plane if a hitter insists on swinging at shoulder high pitches (and then I teach them to ignore the high pitches, unless, like Gomez, she hits them out, a lot). Setting the tee at shoulder height and telling them to hit a line drive is an excellent way to reveal to them any tendency to push their hands down a little to set swing plane and adjust to pitch height. If dad practices this first so he can demonstrate, it's an opportunity to have a little fun at DD's expense and make them think maybe dad does have a clue.

In response to the original post; I would say, unless you're a slap hitter, swinging down is always a bad idea. Swinging down predisposes the body to come forward resulting in lunging. It also will result in a short hitting zone with very little margine for error. Swinging down makes it a lot harder for the hitter to hit the ball square..

Yeah, swinging down through contact, slappers excepted, is goofy.

However some coaches in FP still believe any ball hit in the air is taboo. They want their hitters to keep the ball on the ground. That strategy can work at the younger ages. But as the girls get older, bigger, stronger and faster; it gets harder and harder to hit the ball on the ground through the infield. I don't know about FP, but in MLB, 88% of ground balls are outs. I think a better strategy is to try and hit line drives over the infielder's heads. I tell my daughter to try and hit everything in the air. Preferably line drives.

Yeah, but it seems to be, hopefully, changing over time.

 

[Amy in AZ.]

Forty years ago, we taught swing down. I think my boys were still taught that 10 years ago. DD hit that way until 2007. It was what they were taught. Can it work? Apparently. But it makes for a lot of running, because Caitlin's HRs were inside the park.

Now, the downward plane is different from "an axe chop". You can't hit the ball very often chopping down.

I really am not into the good looking mom's, but I will take the "I can run the grill" dad's kid every time. It is just too bad you can't tell that kind of thing from tryouts. I would also like to know if they own a building that we can practice inside in.

 

[Mark H]

Yeah we have a Lousiana dad that shows up with a table full of crawfish, corn on the cob and potatoes about once a season after a Saturday double header. Happens he knows a thing or two about hitting too.