Questions about batting order

[_MIA_]

the games themselves are pretty different, though.......speed is such a huge factor, small ball is more in play (although power is taking over) you have pitchers who can dominate and pitch far more often than in baseball......i think these factors, amongst others, make lineup optimization a far more important aspect than in baseball

how much more is open to debate, but i think it is a bigger factor

The run expectancy charts for softball and baseball are not much different qualitatively despite these perceived differences..

Anyway here is the "optimal baseball lineup" according to the analysis.

1 Highest OBP on team; Speed is important but ability to get on base matters much more
2 Highest wRC+ on team; Very high OBP; Best overall batter on the team; Must be consistent and balanced
3 Good overall batter; High wRC+; Less important than #5 spot; Likely 4th best hitter overall
4 Most powerful hitter on the team: Must have very high SLG%, HR, ISO
5 Good overall batter with extra emphasis on power. High wRC+; High SLG%; More important than #3 spot; Like 3rd best hitter overall
6 Average/good overall batter with emphasis on baserunning; high OBP and SB
7 Average overall hitter
8 Average overall hitter
9 Worst hitter on the team; likely the pitcher in NL games

Here is the "typical" lineup they compared to:
1 Fastest player on the team; running ability is the most important quality
2 All about bat control; this player likely isn’t your best; they just need to make consistent contact and advance the leadoff baserunner before the big boys take the plate
3 Likely the best overall hitter on the team; highest batting average and very high RBI; should be able to drive in the leadoff hitter
4 The coveted clean-up spot; the most powerful hitter on the team; slugging ability is more important than ability to get on base or consistency
5 Good hitter with strong RBI numbers
6 Average hitter with reasonable RBI numbers
7 Average hitter; often the weakest baserunner on the team
8 Average hitter; ability to make contact is prioritized; backup for #2 spot
9 Worst hitter on the team; likely the pitcher in NL games



wRC stat:

wRC and wRC+

Weighted Runs Created (wRC) is an improved version of Bill James’ Runs Created (RC) statistic, which attempted to quantify a player’s total offensive value and measure it by runs. In Runs Created…

library.fangraphs.com

 

[GunnerShotgun]

Go back through your old games and "optimize" your lineup. Does it lead to more runs and more wins? I have found this not to be the case.

Coaches in softball and baseball have little impact on the outcome of a game. The best you can do is to maximize your margins and hope the other coach does not.

Want to play for a winning team? Find a coach that can evaluate talent (forming the team).

 

[JayW]

The best team with the best coach bats the best HR hitter in NCAA softball history at #2. I align with this philosophy. Get your best hitters the most at bats possible. Their second best homerun hitter bats at #1. All the rest is window dressing.

 

[radness]

The baseball analytics people have used run expectancies for each position in the batting order to devise an "optimal" lineup in terms of scoring runs. What they found was that over the course of a season an optimal lineup would generate between 5 and 15 more runs over a typical lineup (speed at 1, etc, etc, ) which works out to like 1 or 2 extra wins per 162 games..hence @GunnerShotgun statement that it doesn't matter that much. The only way this wouldn't work for softball would be if those run expectancy numbers were wildly different in softball..which I don't think they are.

Yes... already got that as I previously commented I am not much of a statistics only person myself.
Simply thought maybe Gunnershotgun could have added some words of his own . no biggie

 

[radness]

Go back through your old games and "optimize" your lineup. Does it lead to more runs and more wins? I have found this not to be the case.

Coaches in softball and baseball have little impact on the outcome of a game. The best you can do is to maximize your margins and hope the other coach does not.

Want to play for a winning team? Find a coach that can evaluate talent (forming the team).

Ohhh But here it is... maximize your margins that sounds like a thinking process that includes using details.

 

[_MIA_]

Yes... already got that as I previously commented I am not much of a statistics only person myself.
Simply thought maybe Gunnershotgun could have added some words of its own . no biggie

Your comment regarding "pulling players out of a hat" wasn't what @GunnerShotgun was referring to when he said it doesn't matter much. It doesn't matter much compared to the traditional way of setting a batting order..which doesn't involve randomly choosing the batting order.

 

[radness]

Your comment regarding "pulling players out of a hat" wasn't what @GunnerShotgun was referring to when he said it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter much compared to the traditional way of setting a batting order..which doesn't involve randomly choosing the batting order.

I brought up a conversation point to ask Gunner shotgun if there was any proof to not thinking at all about the lineup and just pulling names out of a hat it was directed at Gunner shotgun but it's nice that you jumped in thanks for joining...
Good to read Gunner shotgun added maximize margins...

That would be more than just pulling names out of a hat.

Appreciate his responding. Detail

 

[JayW]

Batting order is one of the areas where what the coach does has the least impact. Much more important are the decisions the coach makes as a third base coach. I can’t believe how many runners I see get thrown out at 3B with no outs, only to see a wild pitch or passed ball on the next pitch.

 

[radness]

Batting order is one of the areas where what the coach does has the least impact. Much more important are the decisions the coach makes as a third base coach. I can’t believe how many runners I see get thrown out at 3B with no outs, only to see a wild pitch or passed ball on the next pitch.

And/or late first base coaching...

 

[_MIA_]

I brought up a conversation point to ask Gunner shotgun if there was any proof to not thinking at all about your lineup and just pulling names out of a hat it was directed at Gunner shotgun but it's nice that you jumped in thanks for joining...

I am sorry. Next time I will speak only when spoken to...

I was trying to help you to understand what he was talking about but it seems that didn't work
since you are still referring to "out of a hat" which is NOT what the comparison is..I'll stop now.