playing for money?

[Yanko70]

Sparky, how would this effect their scholarships? The players don't win the money, the team does. It's considered "Travel expenses".

Bill

Any thing that has some monetary value is currently prohibited by the the NCAA, travel expenses have value. It's archaic but thems the rules as we speak. There have been more than a few kids get pinged for taking travel from a booster. It could work if the money only went to the org but that would get slimey in a hurry.

Sounds like the tournament would be more for the spectators, which is fine, would be nice if the pro leagues or a pro league would catch on.

Sent from my Moto Z3 Play using Tapatalk

 

[Quigs10]

Many of us have seen or experienced the act of coaches/orgs bringing in "ringers" to add to TB rosters for big tournaments or the combining two teams into one so as to have a better chance at winning. And thats jist for a fricken trophy or plaque! Imagine how bad it would be or could be if $$$ was on the line??

My older DD TB team was just local kids from 3 nearby Rec leagues that were together for about 2 yrs. Some adds drops here and there over time...but slowly developed and everybody got PT and knew their roles.

We played in a "National Championship" TCS tourny in 2017 and we get to the finals and play a team that we found out was a combination of two top level teams. The top players from each team only to form one team...just for that tournament. We wondered...why do half the girls have 1 style helmet and the other half have a different style helmet? (Same organization "Firecrackers" but helmet design was sligjtly different.)

Within the rules and "legal" to do? Yes. But kind of bush league to do that for one tourny.

Id be pissed as a parent if my kid was playing or starting for a long time and practicing all the time and paying our dues for a TB team and then the coach/organization brings in a player or two or more that take my daughters position just becuase the tournament has $$$ on the line.

 

[radness]

Many of us have seen or experienced the act of coaches/orgs bringing in "ringers" to add to TB rosters for big tournaments or the combining two teams into one so as to have a better chance at winning. And thats jist for a fricken trophy or plaque! Imagine how bad it would be or could be if $$$ was on the line??

My older DD TB team was just local kids from 3 nearby Rec leagues that were together for about 2 yrs. Some adds drops here and there over time...but slowly developed and everybody got PT and knew their roles.

We played in a "National Championship" TCS tourny in 2017 and we get to the finals and play a team that we found out was a combination of two top level teams. The top players from each team only to form one team...just for that tournament. We wondered...why do half the girls have 1 style helmet and the other half have a different style helmet? (Same organization "Firecrackers" but helmet design was sligjtly different.)

Within the rules and "legal" to do? Yes. But kind of bush league to do that for one tourny.

Id be pissed as a parent if my kid was playing or starting for a long time and practicing all the time and paying our dues for a TB team and then the coach/organization brings in a player or two or more that take my daughters position just becuase the tournament has $$$ on the line.

Unfortunately that scrnario you described stacking team happens. During seasons &
more so for bigger events and Nationals.
Same org shuffles....
Picks apart teams....

 

[Jeffellis15]

Ok, indulge me for a minute here. I have a question. Why aren't their money tournaments in girl's softball? Not a National championship for money, just a weekend tournament. Follow me here..

As many know, my origins in the sport came from Men's fastpitch. And in men's fastpitch, it was not uncommon for tournaments to have prize money. Lets say $5,000. So, on any given weekend 8, 10, or 12 teams (or however many) would come to a place for a weekend and play a tournament. First prize to the winning team was $5k. Technically a player getting "paid" for playing is illegal under the rules (although nearly every player on the top 8 teams in men's FP are making money, sometimes upwards of $5k for the weekend to pitch). Everyone knows this and nobody cares, nobody can "prove" it's happening and the game just goes on. And I'm absolutely sure it was going on when someone like Lisa Fernandez, living in LA, went to play for the Brackettes team in Conneticut on weekends. She wasn't flying across the country for fun!!!!!

Now before anyone says "This is 'AMATEUR' softball, not professional!!!!!" I already know that. Men's softball is amateur too but everyone knows there's money involved. Everyone knows there's money involved in girls softball too, where a stud pitcher changes teams and doesn't have to pay annual fees, travel expenses, etc.

So, why isn't this system used in girl's fastpitch? Instead, sometimes 50 teams show up, play their games, win a trophy and then go home.

The prize monies in these tournaments are generated by entry fee's to the tournament and maybe some sponsorship. Mostly the entry fees. And if you're team is paying $500 to enter a tournament, multiply that by 50 teams, that's a lot of money. I know you have to pay the umpires, grounds crew, etc. but that's not 1/2 of the income received. Is it greed on the part of a tournament director that doesn't want to lose any of his money?

I think it'd be interesting if a top program in the USA, lets pick any club: Beverly Bandits since everyone knows of them. If they said, "We're offering $5k first prize for our July 4th tournament" Would that entice OC Batbusters, Texas Bombers, Iowa Premier, Washington Ladyhawks, etc. to travel there for the tournament? Not only are you seeing the top teams but you have a chance to win something too. Again, I realize the $5k prize is INFINITELY less than what it costs to go play: Flights, rental cars, hotels, meals, etc. But some of these top teams are traveling via plane on a lot of weekends anyway. So the teams have already budgeted for the weekend in Chicago costing X amount. So if a team is planning their annual schedule for July 4th and they see a tournament in Dallas (for example) with good competition and they see the Bandit's tournament with good teams AND the prize money, which would they go for?

I truly wonder if this system would work. Thoughts?

 

[Jeffellis15]

Ok, indulge me for a minute here. I have a question. Why aren't their money tournaments in girl's softball? Not a National championship for money, just a weekend tournament. Follow me here..

As many know, my origins in the sport came from Men's fastpitch. And in men's fastpitch, it was not uncommon for tournaments to have prize money. Lets say $5,000. So, on any given weekend 8, 10, or 12 teams (or however many) would come to a place for a weekend and play a tournament. First prize to the winning team was $5k. Technically a player getting "paid" for playing is illegal under the rules (although nearly every player on the top 8 teams in men's FP are making money, sometimes upwards of $5k for the weekend to pitch). Everyone knows this and nobody cares, nobody can "prove" it's happening and the game just goes on. And I'm absolutely sure it was going on when someone like Lisa Fernandez, living in LA, went to play for the Brackettes team in Conneticut on weekends. She wasn't flying across the country for fun!!!!!

Now before anyone says "This is 'AMATEUR' softball, not professional!!!!!" I already know that. Men's softball is amateur too but everyone knows there's money involved. Everyone knows there's money involved in girls softball too, where a stud pitcher changes teams and doesn't have to pay annual fees, travel expenses, etc.

So, why isn't this system used in girl's fastpitch? Instead, sometimes 50 teams show up, play their games, win a trophy and then go home.

The prize monies in these tournaments are generated by entry fee's to the tournament and maybe some sponsorship. Mostly the entry fees. And if you're team is paying $500 to enter a tournament, multiply that by 50 teams, that's a lot of money. I know you have to pay the umpires, grounds crew, etc. but that's not 1/2 of the income received. Is it greed on the part of a tournament director that doesn't want to lose any of his money?

I think it'd be interesting if a top program in the USA, lets pick any club: Beverly Bandits since everyone knows of them. If they said, "We're offering $5k first prize for our July 4th tournament" Would that entice OC Batbusters, Texas Bombers, Iowa Premier, Washington Ladyhawks, etc. to travel there for the tournament? Not only are you seeing the top teams but you have a chance to win something too. Again, I realize the $5k prize is INFINITELY less than what it costs to go play: Flights, rental cars, hotels, meals, etc. But some of these top teams are traveling via plane on a lot of weekends anyway. So the teams have already budgeted for the weekend in Chicago costing X amount. So if a team is planning their annual schedule for July 4th and they see a tournament in Dallas (for example) with good competition and they see the Bandit's tournament with good teams AND the prize money, which would they go for?

I truly wonder if this system would work. Thoughts?

Hillhouse back when Lisa Fernandez and the like were playing with the Brakettes they were not playing for money and they weren't flying back and forth they would come to Connecticut for the Summer and their housing would be paid for and they would get Summer jobs for them. They would also get per diem while on the road.

 

[BT3100]

Wait.. you mean you guys have top level travel pitchers who don't get paid?

 

[uncdrew]

Wait.. you mean you guys have top level travel pitchers who don't get paid?

I accidentally bought our top pitcher a snow cone at the last tourney. It ruined her college eligibility.

 

[Northball]

I accidentally bought our top pitcher a snow cone at the last tourney. It ruined her college eligibility.

Don't you know you're supposed to use a representative from a third party agency to buy the snowcone for her relative who can then give it to the top pitcher with the backdoor promise of a lucrative Sno-Cone endorsement deal once her amateur status is completed?

 

[uncdrew]

Don't you know you're supposed to use a representative from a third party agency to buy the snowcone for her relative who can then give it to the top pitcher with the backdoor promise of a lucrative Sno-Cone endorsement deal once her amateur status is completed?

I'm such a newb.

 

[Orange Socks]

Don't you know you're supposed to use a representative from a third party agency to buy the snowcone for her relative who can then give it to the top pitcher with the backdoor promise of a lucrative Sno-Cone endorsement deal once her amateur status is completed?

Reminds of time when a college coach came to watch a private workout of one of our pitchers (freshman at the time)in a warehouse. Girl was pitching while TB coach and college coach sat on buckets next to each other. Coach asked a question to the coach about the player, the coach walks over to dad to ask the question, dad answers questions, coach goes back to bucket and relays the answer to the coach.