Subject A, Control Subject, Elite College Hitters

[do-over]

Yes, Back towards catcher but, 'around' as in poking someone standing behind you, as the batter.

The hands/shoulders should not rotate away from the pitcher like Cano's do.
"I like my guys to be square" (referring to the hitter's shoulders). - Kevin Long

Look at the Bustos Olympic clip. She is square a long time.

I think Swingbuilder once stated:
"it's tilt not turn" regarding the shoulders and arms.

Kevin Long also stated the hitter's hands, if dropped straight down towards the ground at the conclusion of separation, should be in direct line with the back knee.

This young lady would not meet any of the above conditions above. I think she should meet them. All of them.

The world would be a much better place if all hitters tilted and didn't turn.

Just sayin'.

Happy New Year

 

[tjintx]

Not so much. Back sure, higher elbow perhaps, but around (depending on what you are referring to) no. In my ever so humble opinion.
Around contributes significantly to the issue you correctly pointed out in post #4 in this thread.


Donny B. - "rock the U"
Rudy Jaramillo - "keep the shoulders square to the plate for as long as possible."
Miggy - observe
Donaldson - observe. It all happens in front and relatively square to the plate.

The young lady has too much "around" and that will catch up to her at the older levels.

IMHO of course.

Now about this "power triangle" O'Leary speaks of . . . . .

I agree with do-over. rotation is the downfall in these hitters.
Per the bold above do-over. How would you go about getting these hitters to maintain their orientation to home plate?
Would you have them focus on their shoulders? Keep your shoulders square to the plate....
I'd love to hear your spin on this There's a few that are trying to find the right wording to move the body in a way that could be viewed in a basic sense as "keep your shoulders square to the plate" or "it all happens in front, relative to the plate" TJ

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Not so much. Back sure, higher elbow perhaps, but around (depending on what you are referring to) no. In my ever so humble opinion.
Around contributes significantly to the issue you correctly pointed out in post #4 in this thread.


Donny B. - "rock the U"
Rudy Jaramillo - "keep the shoulders square to the plate for as long as possible."
Miggy - observe
Donaldson - observe. It all happens in front and relatively square to the plate.

The young lady has too much "around" and that will catch up to her at the older levels.

IMHO of course.

Now about this "power triangle" O'Leary speaks of . . . . .

Speaking of "O'Leary" ..... you stepped in it again!

'Around', in this particular case, would have the 'loading' occurring in the sagittal plane ... and the swing should be pretty much launched in the sagittal plane (not the frontal plane).

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

The hands/shoulders should not rotate away from the pitcher like Cano's do.
"I like my guys to be square" (referring to the hitter's shoulders). - Kevin Long

Look at the Bustos Olympic clip. She is square a long time.

I think Swingbuilder once stated:
"it's tilt not turn" regarding the shoulders and arms.

Kevin Long also stated the hitter's hands, if dropped straight down towards the ground at the conclusion of separation, should be in direct line with the back knee.

This young lady would not meet any of the above conditions above. I think she should meet them. All of them.

The world would be a much better place if all hitters tilted and didn't turn.

Just sayin'.

Happy New Year

That would be Doc Yeager ... and the cue is "more tilt, less turn" ... and it is applied to the bracing portion of the swing to allow the arms to whip out.

 

[lhowser]

The hands/shoulders should not rotate away from the pitcher like Cano's do.
"I like my guys to be square" (referring to the hitter's shoulders). - Kevin Long

Look at the Bustos Olympic clip. She is square a long time.

I think Swingbuilder once stated:
"it's tilt not turn" regarding the shoulders and arms.

Kevin Long also stated the hitter's hands, if dropped straight down towards the ground at the conclusion of separation, should be in direct line with the back knee.

This young lady would not meet any of the above conditions above. I think she should meet them. All of them.

The world would be a much better place if all hitters tilted and didn't turn.

Just sayin'.

Happy New Year

I can totally see it (after it was described using these tips and cues...good stuff). Yesterday we had a practice. She was cranking liners and hot grounders to left left center which was for her very frustrating because she wants to lift the ball over outfield even more (she's pretty good, usually .400 - .500) She isn't satisfied at all. We started to make a few changes that inadvertently resulted in more tilt (she was actually working on a first move focus of getting the barrel in line the front forearm and below the hands as quickly as possible). The trajectory of most hits changes immediately to more towering shots to center, center left. When I came home and studied do-overs tips it made sense. I will shoot some video of indoor ball this weekend and see how much she can begin to apply any adjustments to game situations. Also forum don't forget Subject A.

 

[FP26]

I agree with do-over. rotation is the downfall in these hitters.
Per the bold above do-over. How would you go about getting these hitters to maintain their orientation to home plate?
Would you have them focus on their shoulders? Keep your shoulders square to the plate....
I'd love to hear your spin on this There's a few that are trying to find the right wording to move the body in a way that could be viewed in a basic sense as "keep your shoulders square to the plate" or "it all happens in front, relative to the plate" TJ

TJ - What is different between the quotes above and the underlying thoughts of A$$/BB?

 

[tjintx]

TJ - What is different between the quotes above and the underlying thoughts of A$$/BB?

FP, In short, it depends on the focus.
For example, Say a hitter's rear elbow is getting stuck(stalling in the ribcage). Is the focus and instruction put on the rear elbow" hey hitter, don't drive your rear elbow into your ribcage"
Or is the focus somewhere else " Hey hitter, let's try a new way of moving our body that will allow your rear elbow to flow freely"

I'm waiting to hear DO-OVER's take on the cues. TJ

 

[RichK]

Do you see this as the hands "shaping" the swing and delivering the barrel? I do not. I would work to put the hands more in control of delivering the barrel and start by shaping a more oppo or as rdbass said "out from" swing path with the pivot point being the hands vs. a wide sweep around the shoulders.

As a thought exercise, take the bat out of her hand and place a towel in it instead. Would this "swing" snap the towel or wave it across the target with very little whipping action? I think the latter.

There are some similar big muscle actions with your hitters and Donaldson's, but look at how he uses his hands -- much different. His actions are both 1) driven by his hand usage and 2) done to get to that point where his hands can find and deliver the barrel square to the ball

 

[mann]

YES input please. DD has been a very successful hitter but she wants to change, improve and understand good mechanics. Subject A works hard and wants to get better. I think talking about real game swings by kids can help everyone on the forum.

You guys are so lucky. an indoor space. Simple step towards a solid career, "overlap" in the correct sequence. As been said in these other posts, in different words.

 

[do-over]

That would be Doc Yeager ... and the cue is "more tilt, less turn" ... and it is applied to the bracing portion of the swing to allow the arms to whip out.

That isn't correct. It has nothing to do with your posted dribble.

I'm referring to keeping square to the plate and preventing my definition of "around".

Don't tell me what I'm referencing.

For the record, "tilt not turn" is not a Yeager thing. He may be referencing that now, with a different meaning
but
"Tilt not turn" is a cue/concept that we picked up from Swingbuilder years ago over at BBD.com.
He posted vids from lessons of older (college I think) hitters. Including vids of him instructing Nadia Taylor. I think he also coined the phrase "The shoulders are bypassed". Which we adhere to.

He was/is very knowledgeable, as you know, and freely advises anyone who wants info from him.