Stride foot position at landing

[Edy]

I've been trying to better understand the absolutes in pitching form and I have some doubts when it comes to the landing of the stride foot.

It's said that the foot should contact the ground at approx. 45 degrees. Not too closed towards 3rd base neither too open towards catcher. That's what I usually hear....

but, take a look at some top pitchers' forms:



Monica Abbott's foot is almost straight to catcher. Plus, she apparently crosses the line more than a foot (breaking another absolute).
Ueno is also quite open and also crosses the line a little (less the MA).
Lacey Waldrop seems more closed than 45, and Amanda looks like 45 to me.

Well, my point is, does the position of the foot at landing really matter? I'm not saying one should land with the foot point 3rd. I'm just trying to figure out how much importance it really has to velocity and consistency of pitching.

Bonus question... If Monica didn't cross the line, would she achieve greater speeds?


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[slingnit]

On foot position at landing. Set yourself in the position of the pitchers; toe toward home, 45 degrees and 90 degrees. At each point have someone behind you pushing against you pretty hard. Which position do you have more resistance? From everything I have seen the toe toward home gives you more front side resistance but in my dd's case this caused problems with shoulders squaring too much. So 45 was the happy median. Not sure if this the technical explanation you were looking for but is our experience.

Second she's throwing a breaking ball, if that was a fast ball or a laterally moving pitch I would say probably so.

 

[coach james]

Monica is a freak of nature, for the rest of us out there, if the stride foot orientation is pointed to the catcher too much, it will almost always result in poor trunk rotation, closed shoulders, incorrect spin, poor posture, and most commonly HE arm mechanics.
If it's too closed at landing it 1st and foremost is dangerous. She is susceptible to rolled ankes and torn ligaments in her knee. Not to mention an inability to fully resist on her front side, and that will negate all the stored energy from the stride.
Remember, people are like snow flakes. Everyone is a little bit different. Different body types, muscle mass, height, arm and leg lengths etc... You need to fully understand the mechanics of it and the benifits and risks associated with doing it right or wrong. If you don't know just yet, get a PC until you are more competent.

 

[Classof2020]

"However for a young pitcher (they tend to walk through the landing, etc.), they need to land at 45 degrees. And more people just plain getting a PC would help cut the clutter of analysis on things that are not necessary so you can get to what is really going on." (Quote from OILF above)

Not everyone has access to an amazing PC. And some PC's are just plain horrible. So having a resource like DFP to deal with " the clutter of analysis on things" is ideal. This site it an amazing resource for many people who DO want to discuss the minutia of pitching. And it isn't clutter! that's just plain rude. If you think it's too mundane then don't read these posts, and don't comment on these posts and focus on "what is really going on."

Back to the OP I wonder if some of the ability to be able to handle that landing just requires the strength of an extremely advanced pitcher. I know my DD when foot is too straight seems to close up more and collapse her body into her leg a bit with the force of the landing. Would be interested to see some pics of men pitching too and see how they tend to land, although they are landing from a slightly different launch then the women.

 

[Edy]

On foot position at landing. Set yourself in the position of the pitchers; toe toward home, 45 degrees and 90 degrees. At each point have someone behind you pushing against you pretty hard. Which position do you have more resistance? From everything I have seen the toe toward home gives you more front side resistance but in my dd's case this caused problems with shoulders squaring too much. So 45 was the happy median. Not sure if this the technical explanation you were looking for but is our experience.

That's exactly what I feel when pitching. Foot pointing catcher gives me stronger resistance than 45 (or more closed orientation).

Monica is a freak of nature, for the rest of us out there, if the stride foot orientation is pointed to the catcher too much, it will almost always result in poor trunk rotation, closed shoulders, incorrect spin, poor posture, and most commonly HE arm mechanics.
If it's too closed at landing it 1st and foremost is dangerous. She is susceptible to rolled ankes and torn ligaments in her knee. Not to mention an inability to fully resist on her front side, and that will negate all the stored energy from the stride.
Remember, people are like snow flakes. Everyone is a little bit different. Different body types, muscle mass, height, arm and leg lengths etc... You need to fully understand the mechanics of it and the benifits and risks associated with doing it right or wrong. If you don't know just yet, get a PC until you are more competent.

I agree.. She's an awesome pitcher in many ways.
I understand we aren't built exactly the same, but I still believe it's not a coincidence that two of the greatest and fastest female pitchers in the world make the same "mistake"... I tend to believe that they may achieve greater speeds because of better ground resistance (i.e., foot almost straight to catcher). I also believe both have incredible skills and a very strong core to find the sweet spot of truck rotation.

Back to the OP I wonder if some of the ability to be able to handle that landing just requires the strength of an extremely advanced pitcher. I know my DD when foot is too straight seems to close up more and collapse her body into her leg a bit with the force of the landing. Would be interested to see some pics of men pitching too and see how they tend to land, although they are landing from a slightly different launch then the women.

I don't have any videos right now, but judging by the pictures I would guess Folkard lands about 45 and Andrew Kirkpatrick is clearly pointing straight to catcher.



I would like to have more thoughts about the power line too...
Crossing the line a few inches feels more natural to me.. I really have a hard time trying to keep feet in line. And when I do, I cleary lose power comparing to when I cross it about a foot

 

[Ken B]

Crossing the line a few inches feels more natural to me...t

I think Floi would agree that finding what "feels more natural" is the goal. I agree with that as well. The minutia can be a bit tough to wade through, but ultimately, understanding the details can help make the "feels right" make more sense for our kids.

 

[JAD]

You cannot accurately compare still photos of different pitchers stride foot unless you also know what pitch they are throwing. The landing spot and foot angle can be much different for a curveball vs. a screwball.

 

[Amy in AZ.]

For me, I teach that the front foot lands the same as in overhand throwing and hitting. I keep my landing the same.

 

[Doug Romrell]

I am recommending to one of my pitching students that she should try to land with her foot more pointed toward the back side of a right-handed batter. Why? In the clips I've taken of her, I've noticed her ankle almost rolling over. I'm thinking having her foot land a little more pointed toward home (say 20-degrees) will help her prevent spraining her ankle.

 

[GunnerShotgun]

"Orientation of the stride foot also appears to be important in producing ball speed. A stride foot which is pointed toward third base (for a right-handed pitcher) at about a 10 to 30 degree angle is optimal for producing ball speed. Pitchers who tended to angle the stride foot too much (greater than 30 degrees) had slower release speeds. "