Size and velocity.

[chinamigarden]

Someone needs to throw BP.

And 100% of the daddies on this board would be proud to say that their DD was on the national championship ASU team, regardless of whether she was a starter or not.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

And 100% of the daddies on this board would be proud to say that their DD was on the national championship ASU team, regardless of whether she was a starter or not.

Nothing wrong with that.

 

[RookKev]

Quick body movements? I'm not sure I've heard this terminology yet. Could you expand on that at all, maybe even some video?

 

[Jojo]

Quick body movements? I'm not sure I've heard this terminology yet. Could you expand on that at all, maybe even some video?

You have explosive kids and sluggish kids. I have more little ones that explode off the rubber and get quick rotations, fast arm circles.

Then I have those that just walk off the rubber or push off so slowly it looks like they are pitching in slow motion. I give them quick motion drills to help them speed up, but they generally have to rely on strength than body speed to get any speed.
Some kids have natural quick flex muscles. Others have to work on them.

 

[halskinner]

You have explosive kids and sluggish kids. I have more little ones that explode off the rubber and get quick rotations, fast arm circles.

Then I have those that just walk off the rubber or push off so slowly it looks like they are pitching in slow motion. I give them quick motion drills to help them speed up, but they generally have to rely on strength than body speed to get any speed.
Some kids have natural quick flex muscles. Others have to work on them.

Aggressive athleticism. Either it is aggressive, or it isnt.

 

[vdubya]

You love your idea, because you love your idea. I hate your premise, because of what's implied. "Well, golly Sheila, you're only 5-2, 102 lbs, so you can expect to reach a maximum velocity of x, but only after you've achieved 'optimal mechanics', the coefficient of which we shall call o. The maximum value of o is 1."

I've seen tall, thin pitchers throw really fast, but have seen just as many who were really slow and still more who were about average for their age range. I've seen short, fat pitchers throw the same. I've seen medium height pitchers with stocky-looking builds throw the same as the first two groups. Try quantifying 'stocky-looking'.

Telling a young person they can expect to reach an adult height of 5-4 because both parents are about that tall is one thing, but telling them they should only ever expect to pitch 42mph is another. Other than sleeping and eating right, height isn't something one can really achieve on their own through hard work combined with genetic predisposition. Height is almost entirely up to one's genetics.

You should do your data collection, though, since you feel there's value in it. Maybe only scientists will ever see the information, but from a conceptual standpoint only, I don't like it, because there are just way too many variables which cannot be measured that result in huge deviations in velocity among pitchers of similar body types, ages, and years of experience.

You are entitled to your fun, though.

Um...swing and a miss, but really nice try. I didn't expect everyone to be able to wrap their brain around this.

 

[SoftSocDad]

I can imagine someone telling the moneyball guy he was wasteing his time with all his useless stats.
Yes, there are many intangeables in pitching, just as there is in any athletic activity, but don't be fooled, size does matter. Height, weight, and velocity are measureable.
Perhaps a chart like this would be good to pinpoint a girl who is underacheiving. I don't know how fast my dd throws but if I did I would like to know how she stacks up. IMHO, any parent/coach that would use a stat like this to disqualify a child at a young age has bigger issues than velocity.
I have seen a chart that shows how fast Jenny Finch threw at certain ages and that is amazing. I can imagine few equal her velocity but everyone can't be the best(that is not a justification for mediocrity, just a fact).
Good luck and please post your findings.

Ah, moneyball.

I'm a numbers guy and there's evidence to support many of the concepts held by Beane. But a key element that so few people are ever willing to discuss (because they're caught up in labeling Beane a 'genius') is the fact that the A's caught lightning in a bottle by being able to have three young aces in Zito, Mulder, and Hudson in their rotation at the same time when each was on his 1st MLB contract. That lasted about 3 seasons, if I recall. Most teams don't get that lucky.

6-2, 205 lbs means nothing, though, if the player doesn't want to throw the ball through the wall like the 5-5, 145 lb'er does. My DD used to love gymnastics, but like many parents, I began tempering her expectations pretty early on, because I knew she was going to be tall. Was it wrong of me to steer her towards other activities because of her body type? Am I a bad guy for essentially disqualifying her from gymnastics because of her size?

The thing that makes softball different from gymnastics and a lot of other sports is that a player doesn't have to have a certain body type to be successful. So maybe the player who tops out at 5-3 won't ever pitch for a WCWS championship, but I bet a lot of coaches at the younger levels would love to have a shortstop who could come in as an emergency pitcher.

 

[chinamigarden]

The line between truely elite pitchers and darn good ones is pretty wide. And not very many girls are capable to make that jump.

But the level just below the top, is still pretty good, and can get a girl into college to play. I think there are many, many factors that determine how well and how fast a girl can pitch. But if you take all the girls who all have those same factors, the ones with the longest arms and the greatest stride, and the more weight to put behind the ball are going to have an advantage. But size without those other factors will not be as effective as a smaller girl who has everything else.

 

[CoachFP]

This is a discussion where everyone really knows the answer but they are dancing around it. Being big and strong matters. Check out the best (very best) pitchers in the last 10 years and the bigger and stronger ones throw the hardest. There are exceptions but you can't teach a girl to be 6'2 and athletic. If you are not tall you better be extremely strong and explosive (see Lisa Fernandez). One or the other gets it for you. If you have a kid that is small, relatively weak and not that athletic I don't care what mechanics she has she will top out somewhere in the low 50's no matter what us geniuses teach her.