Leaping? Or replanting?

[Kraedad]

Yesterday at my DD's club practice, I noticed about 75% of the pitchers have adopted this leaping style. (not my DD)
I am curious if anyone here has made that transition, and what the experience has been like.
Speed increases? Improved spin and spot?
Would be curious too, if any PC's here have made the "leap"?

 

[RADcatcher]

Normal will be normal.
= typical, usual, to be expected.

Hit the ball.
= typical, usual, to be expected.

 

[Hillhouse]

The only thing I've told my students, 10u-college, is: you no longer have to worry about your back foot. Then, I let them go. As long as whatever new "style" they want to pitch does NOT affect the absolutes needed, she's free to do anything she wants in my book. But that freedom comes with this warning: we do not know the umpires are going to be calling this. So if she wants to adopt this form of pitching, she's got to be aware of potential consequences of illegal pitches. And she'd BETTER know how to make adjustments. Moreover, absolutely nothing says that she won't be legal in one ump's eyes, illegal in another's eyes. So there's going to be a lot of inconsistency.

I mean, seriously. We still have umpires out there (and many many coaches and parents in the stands) who don't even know that "present the ball" went out of the rule book 40 years ago. So we're going to expect a guy who hasn't updated his rule book since 1980 to understand the differences between leaping and crowhopping? Yea right. @lostcreek1 spoke about how crazy this is and lack of cohesive understanding of rules. Amen. It would take a 5 minute zoom call between: NCAA, PGF, Alliance, USSSA, and USA softball to make one rule. But they're all driven by ego and money therefore they won't do it. Instead they all wanna boast about how their organization is the best.

I have mixed feeling on this rule change. I think we all know it was inevitable. The evolution of softball pitching shows more and more pitchers leap and crow hop. Personally I believe this is in direct relation to the ongoing advantages hitters get each year with new bats, polycore balls, slappers allowed to be out of the box, etc. I would have no problem going back to 2 feet on the rubber if the hitters go back to cork balls and wooden bats. But, we all know that will never happen. However, this change didn't happen for any other reason than it's intended to take pressure off the umpires. I doubt many know the difference between leaping/crowhop anyway. And I bet many get smart and tell coaches during the pregame meeting and line up exchanges to not complain, we're not calling IP's. Just one opinion.

 

[Dabears17]

I’m going to a USA Softball National umpire school end of the month. Will try to get clarification on what to call. What I know is there will be high school coaches thinking the opposing pitcher is replanting and chewing on umpires to call it.

I was on a free zoom call that Amanda Scarborough gave where she basically said she wasn’t going to be teaching leaping and was going to teach keeping the foot down, but if someone was leaping and their mechanics were good, she wasn’t going to change it.

I guess I have about a month to look up and figure out what NFHS defines as a crow hop. USA softball rules supplement seems to say a replant is legal as long as it happens after the hands seperate.

1 A CROW HOP is defined as a replant of the pivot foot prior to delivering the
pitch. This can be done by (1) sliding the foot in front, but not in contact with, the pitcher’s plate; (2) lifting the pivot foot and stepping forward; or (3) jumping forward from the pitcher’s plate with the pivot foot prior to starting the pitch. Umpires should look at the location of the pivot foot when the hands separate, the start of the pitch. If the pivot foot is off and in front of the pitcher’s plate before the hands separate, this would be a crow hop and an illegal pitch should be called. (2024 USA Softball rules, page 145)

From what I saw at the CWS last year umpires weren’t calling leaping, but called sliding the foot in front of the plate, not in contact, before starting the pitch, a couple times.

 

[Hillhouse]

From what I saw at the CWS last year umpires weren’t calling leaping, but called sliding the foot in front of the plate, not in contact, before starting the pitch, a couple times.

Hopefully you're willing to share what they say at the umpire convention. However, regardless of what USA softball says, there's nothing stopping Alliance, PGF, USSSA etc from telling umps in their events to ignore USA rules, follow these rules.... whatever they may be.

Yes, a lot of people don't realize that a "gym step" is simply a crowhop without the leaping. They are the same thing, minus the jump. However, in my experience, most pitchers only do the gym step in gyms. This is because in a gym, even on a pitching mat, there is NOTHING to push from. So they cheat to try generating power. However, outside on a field the rubber is in the ground and can used for the push. I'm not saying ALL but the majority who do the gym step indoors do not do it outdoors. But they are the same thing. Monica Abbott is a glaring example of one who DID do the step when outdoors. But the majority do not.

 

[bsbs]

My daughter's pitching coach had the girls getting over a weight plate to get rid of their drag. My kid has always been a little jumpy so there isn't much of an adjustment for her.

 

[Kraedad]

The only thing I've told my students, 10u-college, is: you no longer have to worry about your back foot. Then, I let them go. As long as whatever new "style" they want to pitch does NOT affect the absolutes needed, she's free to do anything she wants in my book. But that freedom comes with this warning: we do not know the umpires are going to be calling this. So if she wants to adopt this form of pitching, she's got to be aware of potential consequences of illegal pitches. And she'd BETTER know how to make adjustments. Moreover, absolutely nothing says that she won't be legal in one ump's eyes, illegal in another's eyes. So there's going to be a lot of inconsistency.

I mean, seriously. We still have umpires out there (and many many coaches and parents in the stands) who don't even know that "present the ball" went out of the rule book 40 years ago. So we're going to expect a guy who hasn't updated his rule book since 1980 to understand the differences between leaping and crowhopping? Yea right. @lostcreek1 spoke about how crazy this is and lack of cohesive understanding of rules. Amen. It would take a 5 minute zoom call between: NCAA, PGF, Alliance, USSSA, and USA softball to make one rule. But they're all driven by ego and money therefore they won't do it. Instead they all wanna boast about how their organization is the best.

I have mixed feeling on this rule change. I think we all know it was inevitable. The evolution of softball pitching shows more and more pitchers leap and crow hop. Personally I believe this is in direct relation to the ongoing advantages hitters get each year with new bats, polycore balls, slappers allowed to be out of the box, etc. I would have no problem going back to 2 feet on the rubber if the hitters go back to cork balls and wooden bats. But, we all know that will never happen. However, this change didn't happen for any other reason than it's intended to take pressure off the umpires. I doubt many know the difference between leaping/crowhop anyway. And I bet many get smart and tell coaches during the pregame meeting and line up exchanges to not complain, we're not calling IP's. Just one opinion.

Appreciate the feedback and perspective from a respected PC. Our PC is staying the course with the sound fundamentals we have been working on. It just kind of astonished me how many girls in our area have made that transition already. I can see the benefit of being closer to the batter at release, but I'm really curious what other effect this is having on measurable performance. Positive or negative.

 

[Hillhouse]

Appreciate the feedback and perspective from a respected PC. Our PC is staying the course with the sound fundamentals we have been working on. It just kind of astonished me how many girls in our area have made that transition already. I can see the benefit of being closer to the batter at release, but I'm really curious what other effect this is having on measurable performance. Positive or negative.

Kind words, thank you. I don't think there's much doubt that this is going to be the future of the sport. Pitching in female softball (girls and women) will soon look similar to this and most of the men's pitchers. But I still think it'll take a couple of years for the officials and umpires to catch up and get on the same page about how to call this. I think there will be a mixed bag the first couple years with umpires: some will allow anything, others will call everything illegal.

 

[RADcatcher]

My daughter's pitching coach had the girls getting over a weight plate to get rid of their drag.

...Wooop there it izzz
...Wooop there it izzz

Did the pitching instructor share their perspective on the usefulness of avoiding drag? ( being that they are avoiding it)

 

[daywalkerdad]

I think some overstate leg drive. 85% of the speed comes from the arm. A longer stride can shorten reaction time. Cannot see much gain from leaping unless it is a replant.