Hit this Ball

[knightsb]

I see the demo of TM different with that barrel whip underneath hitting high balls.

For us that's it... a drill... we use it to get a feel for the forearms and hands... we use it as a drill to emphasize launching the barrel rearward.

 

[crankermo]

SL,

The hands stay back as you apply the torque, the can't go forward first and you have to start your swing normally, you don't force your elbow to stay high, that's so un-natural. Like I told Steve Huff you have to have a HPP. Hands,hands,hands

I respect you and I know you want to give the best advide possible but IMO turning the barrel is an absolute just like HC's dynamic loading. The hands HAVE to stay back as you are applying the torque in order to create the massive whip and power turning the barrel creates. I do it naturally but Brooke didn't so I had to explain it to her and once she got it down the difference was amazing.

 

[straightleg]

Here in the northeast, the tournament umps do not give the high strike across the letters nor the knee high strike. They want it on a friggin tee. I know what the strike zone is, that set up of yours would be at or close to her neck. What is that contraption the ball is resting on?

Instructo Swing

Eric brought one to my house, I bought one years back,he is from my area.
Nice guy, good hitting instructor.
I think he travels with a semi-pro team as their hitting instructor...



FYI
TM was some how name calling him years back, and made some kind of vice president remark.
So he made up his own name he goes by, when he posts once in awhile, on hitting forums

Little "E" VIP




SL

 

[straightleg]

SL,

The hands stay back as you apply the torque, the can't go forward first and you have to start your swing normally, you don't force your elbow to stay high, that's so un-natural. Like I told Steve Huff you have to have a HPP. Hands,hands,hands

I respect you and I know you want to give the best advide possible but IMO turning the barrel is an absolute just like HC's dynamic loading. The hands HAVE to stay back as you are applying the torque in order to create the massive whip and power turning the barrel creates. I do it naturally but Brooke didn't so I had to explain it to her and once she got it down the difference was amazing.

Crank
Thats just it, TM and others say we bring the hands forward...I dont teach it that way. I keep the hands back by the rear hip. And they stay there through part of rotation.
Watch any slo-motion swing of Casey and that is where they are at.
I think we just focus on teaching it a different way and some of those ways are not that far apart in my opinion.


FYI
I dont know Steve Huff or what/how he teach's




SL

 

[mann]

Iclifton, and others agree, that swivel happens at the shoulder. That was said yesterday.

In this clip of Manny, i see No swivel, until well out front, where he releases his wrist, from lag to contact.

His wrists stay loaded till the release.

Or in other words, he pulls that top hand back, and it Stays in that position, locked with his turn, till release.
OUT FRONT, with THIS PITCH LOCATION.

mann's Photos : Photo Keywords : mannywrist*

I must open a photo bucket site. This place will not except smugmug loading.



there is no wrist release, or swivel, till this point. Where are his hands?

 

[RayR]

Mann - I guess the question is how the did barrel get to where it is in your second picture of Manny? And if it was done just by shoulder rotation why aren't his hands closer to his shoulder? Why is his rear elbow down? Why is his rear wrist bent like it is?

I know if I simply turn the barrel rearwards my rear wrist gets into the same exact position as Manny's is.

 

[mann]

Mann - I guess the question is how the did barrel get to where it is in your second picture of Manny? And if it was done just by shoulder rotation why aren't his hands closer to his shoulder? Why is his rear elbow down? Why is his rear wrist bent like it is?

I know if I simply turn the barrel rearwards my rear wrist gets into the same exact position as Manny's is.

I think you partly answered your own question about the barrel. His elbow drops.
And i said his wrist is pulled back, loaded.
thats not swivel.

i should not say locked, i should say that the shoulders are more of a platform for the arms and hands. Because the swing is so dynamic, and locked would take away the dynamic proccessessssss.

My point, deep swivel, is not absolute, and does not stand up to elite level swings.
I think you can see where the hands are, and where the swing is occuring, its not behind him,

So yesterday, the point was made, swivel, is at the shoulder, now you say just pull back, not swivel?

 

[4for4]

Sbd

This is swivel barrel dump (SBD), not to be confused with a top hand swivel (from about 2:30 to 2:39 of this video):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYYxrt0602w

or, as lclifton showed elsewhere with Pujols, what I would consider preparation (my words):

I don't think it should be about any particular pitch location. Its really about consistency...as in consistent controllable barrel path. What is shown here can not, in time, create a consistent barrel path that can be controlled. IOW, what is being taught is recovery mode. It puts you in a constant state of recovery...as opposed to the ability to adjust, which is lost when a player is in this constant state of recovery...IOW, adjustability and the recovery mode being taught in the video below are polar opposites...as evidenced in the video posted earlier in this thread:

You can see how the barrel is dumping in this clip...Watch the front arm jack-upward while the barrel is dumping downward (that is not to say the arms don't reorient through the swing)...The barrel path that he created shows the barrel moving in a plane that is almost perpendicular to the front arm in the contact area:

look for the back of the top hand almost vertical to the catcher view camera...when you see this, the hitter is in recovery mode...and what you will see the arms doing to try to recover after this point in the still above is telling. The temptation might be there to look and find a favorable comparison to Josh Hamilton or Gary Sheffield...or even some of the old timers that swung tree trunks in support...I would caution you (anyone) to think of it in different terms...all of these guys (Hamilton,Sheffield,old timers...MLB elite hitters) are attacking with the barrel from above the ball...they are not attacking with the barrel from below the ball.

Adjustablity is consistent barrel awareness and control...it can not exists when you are in a constant state of recovery...Attack from above, not below.

 

[MountieSB]

You can see how the barrel is dumping in this clip...Watch the front arm jack-upward while the barrel is dumping downward (that is not to say the arms don't reorient through the swing)...The barrel path that he created shows the barrel moving in a plane that is almost perpendicular to the front arm in the contact area.

I agree that this clip shows too much barrel dump. Obviously, he's working with a student to develop a feel for something. Not knowing what the specific issue is or what the exact feel he's trying to teach, no one can say that clip implies "This is the barrel path elite hitters use." Obviously, it can't be. I don't think the instructor would say that, either.

At face value, I personally would be cautious of letting the student on the left drop the barrel that far, but I don't know that kid and I don't know what the HC is trying to communicate to his hitter.

The ultimate goal is to get the hitter on plane with the pitch in the most explosive/efficient way possible. Getting on plane is not exclusive of using the early rearward barrel turn and turning the triangle mechanics that have been discussed on here for the past few weeks. I haven't seen this as an "either/or". For me, there has been value in creating whip by stretching and firing the front-side obliques to initiate the turning of the triangle. It feels and sounds explosive. It has been helpful to my hitters.

 

[RayR]

If you are going to swing using only a HPP then yes you will dump the barrel....

Attacking the ball from above is a great swing thought....what other pivot point would turn a barrel dump into a swing that attacks from the top?