I could understand considering runner on second that steals first , and a few other scenarios an intentionally confusing act. I would think a runner on second that steals first had a pre conceived notion to do so. Secondly I’m sure I would have to give it some thought for the simple reason that I’ve never seen that happen before. That being said, we have all witnessed the confusion that ensues on dropped infield fly balls. Not only is the confusion common, it’s expected. So ,from My experience I would be hard pressed to consider it anything else but being dumb
Fly Rule for a Dummy
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No, running the bases in reverse order and confusing the defense isn’t illegal. Running the bases in reverse order TO EXPLICITLY confuse the defense is.
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- May 29, 2015
- 3,820
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Sorry for the length ... but this is a case where you need to look beyond one part of the rule.
I would encourage you to think like an umpire when looking at scenarios like this. Of course, there are both the letter of the game and the spirit of the game. In my opinion, we as umpires should be looking at "What it is the intent of the game?" not "What can they get away with?"
In my (somewhat educated) opinion, BOTH the letter and the spirit are violated by a runner who runs the bases in reverse order without a legally granted reason to do so.
Using NFHS (2020 book) ...
Page 64
THE GAME - In softball each team is permitted seven turns at bat during which it attempts to score runs by having its batters become base runners that advance to and touch first base, second base, third base, and home plate.
The goal of the game is for runners to progress forward in legal order and manner.
2-30 Infield Fly Rule ... runners may advance at their own risk.
Does not grant reason nor opportunity to run the bases backwards.
2-32-1 Interference Interference is an act (physical or verbal) by a member of the team at bat who illegally impedes, hinders, or confuses any fielder ...
Intent is NOT a requirement. Penalty for interference is typically the interfering player called out and all others returning to their last base touched at time of interference.
2-64 Touching Touching is contact with the ball, equipment or a person. There is no distinction between the act of touching or being touched. It applies to a pitched ball touching a batter, a batted ball touching the batter or any runner, catcher touching the bat, player touching a base ...
She had touched second base.
8-1-1 The batter becomes a batter runner when ... A batter becomes a batter-runner with the right to attempt to score by advancing to first, second, and third and then home plate in the listed order ...
A runner does not have a right to run the bases in reverse order.
8-3 Touching bases in legal order
Article 1 ... An advancing runner shall touch first base, second base, third base and then home plate in order.
She was an advancing runner. She is not granted any reason to return once she has acquired the next base.
Article 2 ... When a runner must return to a base while the ball is in play or dead, the runner must touch the base(s) in reverse order. Exception: On a foul ball.
She was not required to return.
Article 3 ... When a runner or batter-runner acquires the right to a base by touching it before being put out, the runner or batter-runner is entitled to hold the base until touching the next base in order or is is forced to vacate it for a succeeding runner.
She was no longer entitled to first base, as she had legally acquired second base.
Article 4 ... When a runner passes a base, she is considered to have touched that base. This also applies to base award.
Even if she had missed second and gone past it, it was hers. If she went past and returned to second, she still has no right to go backwards PAST the missed base.
Article 6 ... A runner shall not run the bases in reverse order either to confuse the fielders or to make a travesty of the game.
Everybody gets hung up on this specific portion. This does not say the runner has to have that intent ... it says that it shall not occur. The result was the defense was confused by the runner who had legally acquired second base -- on purpose or not -- running the bases in reverse order. Running the bases in reverse order without a legal reason to do so, e.g., tagging up, returning to a missed base, is a form of interference.
8-4 Runners Entitled to Advance
Nothing in this section gives the runners the right to run the bases in reverse order. ADVANCE is the key word.
Ancillary references
2-1-6(a) May not return. A runner may not return to touch a missed base or one left too soon on a caught fly ball if: (a.) she has reached a base beyond the base missed or left too soon and the ball becomes dead.
This is about Appeal Plays, but intent of the game is exhibited (runners may not go backwards without a legal reason and opportunity to do so).
2-24-1 A force play is a play in which a runner (or two or three runners) loses the right to the base occupied and is forced to advance because the batter becomes a batter-runner.
The definition of Force Play (this is not a force) establishes the concept that the runner holds the right to the occupied base (not the next base, not the previous base).
5-2-2(b) When the ball becomes dead: (b) a runner may not advance nor return to a base that was not touched or that the runner was not in contact with on a caught fly ball during a live ball if the runner had advanced to or beyond a succeeding base.
Again, not our exact situation, but it is another example of the runner NOT having a right to go backwards once attaining the next base.
Summary: The only legal reason for a player to run bases in reverse order is a requirement to return. This requirement only occurs when the runner left too early on a caught fly ball or missed a base as she passed it. (I am excluding dead ball returns such as foul balls and the requirement to be on the base during a pitch.) Outside of those specific scenarios, a runner who legally acquires the next base has no legal reason or right to return to a previous base.
There are scenarios which would prevent a runner from legally acquiring a base, even if she is on it. These would be things such as the runners ahead of her not advancing (therefor the base was not vacant/available).
A runner has the legal right to the base they have left and may reverse course (unless forced) at any point up until she legally acquires the next base (this is NOT running the bases in reverse order).
I would encourage you to think like an umpire when looking at scenarios like this. Of course, there are both the letter of the game and the spirit of the game. In my opinion, we as umpires should be looking at "What it is the intent of the game?" not "What can they get away with?"
In my (somewhat educated) opinion, BOTH the letter and the spirit are violated by a runner who runs the bases in reverse order without a legally granted reason to do so.
Using NFHS (2020 book) ...
Page 64
THE GAME - In softball each team is permitted seven turns at bat during which it attempts to score runs by having its batters become base runners that advance to and touch first base, second base, third base, and home plate.
The goal of the game is for runners to progress forward in legal order and manner.
2-30 Infield Fly Rule ... runners may advance at their own risk.
Does not grant reason nor opportunity to run the bases backwards.
2-32-1 Interference Interference is an act (physical or verbal) by a member of the team at bat who illegally impedes, hinders, or confuses any fielder ...
Intent is NOT a requirement. Penalty for interference is typically the interfering player called out and all others returning to their last base touched at time of interference.
2-64 Touching Touching is contact with the ball, equipment or a person. There is no distinction between the act of touching or being touched. It applies to a pitched ball touching a batter, a batted ball touching the batter or any runner, catcher touching the bat, player touching a base ...
She had touched second base.
8-1-1 The batter becomes a batter runner when ... A batter becomes a batter-runner with the right to attempt to score by advancing to first, second, and third and then home plate in the listed order ...
A runner does not have a right to run the bases in reverse order.
8-3 Touching bases in legal order
Article 1 ... An advancing runner shall touch first base, second base, third base and then home plate in order.
She was an advancing runner. She is not granted any reason to return once she has acquired the next base.
Article 2 ... When a runner must return to a base while the ball is in play or dead, the runner must touch the base(s) in reverse order. Exception: On a foul ball.
She was not required to return.
Article 3 ... When a runner or batter-runner acquires the right to a base by touching it before being put out, the runner or batter-runner is entitled to hold the base until touching the next base in order or is is forced to vacate it for a succeeding runner.
She was no longer entitled to first base, as she had legally acquired second base.
Article 4 ... When a runner passes a base, she is considered to have touched that base. This also applies to base award.
Even if she had missed second and gone past it, it was hers. If she went past and returned to second, she still has no right to go backwards PAST the missed base.
Article 6 ... A runner shall not run the bases in reverse order either to confuse the fielders or to make a travesty of the game.
Everybody gets hung up on this specific portion. This does not say the runner has to have that intent ... it says that it shall not occur. The result was the defense was confused by the runner who had legally acquired second base -- on purpose or not -- running the bases in reverse order. Running the bases in reverse order without a legal reason to do so, e.g., tagging up, returning to a missed base, is a form of interference.
8-4 Runners Entitled to Advance
Nothing in this section gives the runners the right to run the bases in reverse order. ADVANCE is the key word.
Ancillary references
2-1-6(a) May not return. A runner may not return to touch a missed base or one left too soon on a caught fly ball if: (a.) she has reached a base beyond the base missed or left too soon and the ball becomes dead.
This is about Appeal Plays, but intent of the game is exhibited (runners may not go backwards without a legal reason and opportunity to do so).
2-24-1 A force play is a play in which a runner (or two or three runners) loses the right to the base occupied and is forced to advance because the batter becomes a batter-runner.
The definition of Force Play (this is not a force) establishes the concept that the runner holds the right to the occupied base (not the next base, not the previous base).
5-2-2(b) When the ball becomes dead: (b) a runner may not advance nor return to a base that was not touched or that the runner was not in contact with on a caught fly ball during a live ball if the runner had advanced to or beyond a succeeding base.
Again, not our exact situation, but it is another example of the runner NOT having a right to go backwards once attaining the next base.
Summary: The only legal reason for a player to run bases in reverse order is a requirement to return. This requirement only occurs when the runner left too early on a caught fly ball or missed a base as she passed it. (I am excluding dead ball returns such as foul balls and the requirement to be on the base during a pitch.) Outside of those specific scenarios, a runner who legally acquires the next base has no legal reason or right to return to a previous base.
There are scenarios which would prevent a runner from legally acquiring a base, even if she is on it. These would be things such as the runners ahead of her not advancing (therefor the base was not vacant/available).
A runner has the legal right to the base they have left and may reverse course (unless forced) at any point up until she legally acquires the next base (this is NOT running the bases in reverse order).
Last edited:
- May 29, 2015
- 3,820
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Neither here nor there to this story ... but this is a coach who uses a play he calls "Drop 9". When he yells "Drop 9!" all of the fielders (except pitcher and catcher of course) run to another position just before the pitcher takes her position. And yes, he did it in the game in question.
I have no idea what he thinks that does ... just that he is one of those coaches who thinks he is smarter than the game.
Also for more fun, the game featured an ambidextrous pitcher (yes, she could pitch on land AND in water). Unfortunately she didn't do it so I never got to see it.
In your summary you say once a runner obtains the next base she no longer has a legal right to return to the previous base unless it’s for retouching a base missed or left too soon. Thats not true in USA Softball And I believe NFHS as well. In the RUNNER IS OUT section concerning a force out it states as follows...if the forced runner AFTER TOUCHING THE NEXT BASE RETREATS for ANY REASON toward the base first occupied, the force play is reinstated and the runner MAY again be put out IF the defense tags the runner or the base to which the runner is forced. The ball remains live.
There are all kinds of statements in the rule book about "confusing" the defense, and most things are not interference or an out. A runner juking off third base to get a defensive player to look at them and delay a throw to first base is perfectly legal and is a direct attempt to "confuse" the defense. Is that interference? No, it is not and any umpire that called it would not have a job very long. Did the runner cited in the play purposely steal 1st base to confuse the defense? No they did not. And yes, I have seen situations happen where a runner thought they were out, or thought the 3rd out was made and started to head off the field from 2nd base and when they realized their mistake just jumped onto 1st base to keep from being put out. Just because a runner retreated from an advanced base does not automatically make it an out.
- May 29, 2015
- 3,820
- 113
I had a hunch somebody would bring up that rule, however it does NOT say the runner can legally run the bases in reverse order. The rule says a force is not negated by reaching the base IF the runner retreats.
So, let's say the pop fly was NOT an infield fly ... just the runner on first base. The runner runs on the pop fly which is dropped. She gets to second base safely, then it registers in her brain that the coach was yelling "get back" so she retreats to first base. The rule you reference (2-24-4 in NFHS) states the force play is reinstated -- it is not negated because she reached second base safely. Again, it does not say the runner has any legal right to run the bases backwards.
This rule gives the defense the proper recourse (touching the bag) to avoid being suckered into chasing the runner around.
- May 29, 2015
- 3,820
- 113
We have had this same debate in many different fashions -- what is "confusing the defense"? Some items are defined, some items are not. As umpires, we need to determine whether something is within the spirit of the game or not -- and we may not all have the same standards. Juking off a base is in the spirit of the game.
As with obstruction and interference calls, "purposely" is not a part of the rule. Intent is not a part of the rule. The result is.
In the cases you described, a runner mistakenly thinking they were out, if they had advanced to the next base safely, they cannot just jump on any random base when they realize their error. I hope you made the right call.
I agree, just because a runner retreated from an advanced base does not automatically make it an out. I don't think I ever said that (if I did, point it out and I will fix it). I said she has no legal right to retreat. As I said, had the defense NOT made a play which allowed the runner from third to score, we would have shrugged our shoulders and left the runners on first and third. It was the defense making a play resulting in another runner advancing (specifically scoring in this case) that triggered the penalty.
Well, ok..If that’s the way you want to interpret the original scenario as the runner intentionally confusing the defense by running the bases in reverse I guess you could sell it to someone but in my opinion you are really stretching it. I’m not blowing my horn because I know there’s lots of umpires on here that have just as much or more experience than I have including you. I’ve umpired thousands of games at all levels just like lots of other umpires on here including you. I have seen the confusion ensue many many times from an infield fly ball being dropped just like you and the others. I have never considered any of the action that followed anything more than just that, confusion from being stupid. Nor has any other umpire that I’ve worked with ever see it any other way. In fact I’ve never even heard of umpire rule it any other way. I have to believe that your position is quite unique. I guess the best I could give you that I’d have to be there
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