Cage hitting VS Live game Action

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Hitter

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Dec 6, 2009
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I have copied this before and believe it to be very informative as to teaching and coaching and after 21 years feel it is a plan by which to teach.

I have worked with some of the best female hitters and consider their input "price less" as they let me ask questions most would probably never get an answer to in most situations.

They understood I would not ues the information against them or compromise their privacy by them teaching me.

It really boils down to how you communicate with each hitter and the progression in teaching is the journey to them understanding it.

Look at the NFL and the amount of time they prepare for a game and the amount of time it takes them to do it! And they play once a week!

Many have said hitting a baseball is the most difficult thing to do in all of sports and how much quality time do we spend doing it?

Look at your daughters and be honest and tell me how much time do they put into getting better at their sport by them self.

There is a lot of good information in this board and sharing knowledge helps however for me it comes down to how you teach it and the progression in which it is done.
Do all of your kids actually learn in the same manner? No!

From the net....The visual learner tends to learn best by seeing. These people think in pictures and have vivid imaginations. Being able to actually see what it is they're trying to absorb helps this type of learner attain skills most effectively. The visual learner tends to learn best through demonstration, pictures, videos etc. Experts estimate that 60 to 65% of the populations are visual learners.

The auditory learner talks about what to do when they learn. These types of learners enjoy listening, but also talk as they learn. The auditory learner learns best through lecture or through descriptions of "what to do". Experts estimate that 30% of the populations are auditory learners.

Finally, the kinesthetic or tactual learner prefers to touch and manipulate things. Kinesthetic learners learn best by doing and tend to express feelings physically. Interestingly, most students doing poorly in school are kinesthetic learners. Instruction in schools is generally geared toward the other modalities and consequently the kinesthetic learner falls behind, loses confidence and may eventually come to resent school. It is estimated that 10% of the population are kinesthetic learners.

Finally I think this article really puts the attention that maybe it is HOW we teach what we all think works best and then look at the data or results to see if how WE taught it worked or if it is us the instructor. When we practice it is always understanding the little things pitchers and others coaches are doing and looking for that give them an idea as to what are weakness may be and how they try and exploit it at game time!

Especially with my pitchers and catchers, I always say if we are hitting what or how would you pitch yourself based on your stance and attitude during a game? If you are playing first and just struck out in a game with bases loaded you are my prime target to bunt to , to see if you are still thinking about the strike out!

From the net......It’s Not What They Do, It’s How They Do It:
Athlete Experiences of Great Coaching
Andrea J. Becker
Department of Kinesiology, California State University, Fullerton,
P.O. Box 6870, Fullerton, CA 92834-6870, USA
E-mail: anbecker@fullerton.edu

Teach
One of the most basic actions that these great coaches engaged in was teaching. Athletes discussed how their coaches taught sport skills that were cognitive (strategies, tactics, and systems of play), physical (fitness, performance techniques, and fundamental game skills), and mental (focus, imagery, anticipation, and mindset). However, these athletes also expressed how “great coaches actually teach you about life” (p16) [44]. The category of life skills included values, attitudes, and beliefs. Some of the skills that these athletes learned were how to deal with pressure, handle adversity, and work with others. They also learned respect, patience, and self-reliance. Their coaches didn’t just teach these skills, they modeled them: “We learned to have a good attitude because coach had a good attitude” (p2). In addition to modeling behaviors, these great coaches adopted a multi-dimensional approach to teaching their athletes. Athletes discussed how their coaches used a combination of verbal, visual, and physical methods: “Some people get it from reading it, some people get it from the visual, and some people get it from actually doing it, but those are the three ways [that these coaches] presented it” (p1). Verbal methods included basic instruction, feed back, and questioning. The coach encouraged athletes to be active rather than passive learners. “He would question you and make you think about what you were doing and why it was wrong and what you needed to do next time” (p11); “Then he would tell you what he saw” (p1). Some of the visual methods that these coaches implemented to teach skills were physical demonstrations, chalk talks, scouting reports, and video clips: “I’m a visual learner so she didn’t just talk to me. She kind of got in there and showed me, held my hand, and we video- International Journal of Sports Science & Coaching Volume 4 • Number 1 • 2009 107 taped” (p13); “A lot of coaches teach you how to study film, how to study a different player, how to study your opponent” (p16). As a result, these athletes also developed the ability to identify their own strengths and weaknesses. Some athletes got to the point where they could coach themselves.

Physical teaching methods included manual manipulation and repetition. Manual manipulation represented instances in which the “coach physically moved [players] to certain places” (p17). However, most of these athletes focused on how their coaches emphasized repetition: “It was just making you do it over and over and over again until you got it right” (p5). Repetition did not mean going through the motions. It meant performing with precision: “I think we ran 80 something perfect plays one day after practice. If you do it perfect in practice, it carries over to the game” (p1). It appears that great coaching involves utilizing a combination of teaching methods, which maximize athlete learning.
The athletes also spoke about the quality of their coaches’ teaching methods. Specifically, they emphasized how their coaches paid “great attention to the little details” (p13). These coaches had the ability to “pull out the finer things when teaching a player” (p14), and instructions were specific. They did not tell their players to “just get it done” (p1). Instead, they explained exactly how to get it done [2, 3, 8]. The athletes also mentioned how their coaches simplified the process. One athlete explained how his coach “always found a way to break things down to the most simplistic sense” (p15).

Another athlete said that his coach sometimes had players practice their skills in slow motion.
In general, training sessions were designed so that there was a progression from simple to complex: “You would start out small and go big and he would build on his teachings. When we moved from simple to complex, the purpose of the drill was not lost. The same theme ran through each progression” (p12).These athletes’ comments suggest that great coaches pace their instruction according to each athlete’s learning curve.
Note: This is just a part of the study and not the complete article!

This has some of why we do not hit in a game the way we did in practice written all over it in my opinion and how we prepare our players.

Thanks Howard
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2009
3,331
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I remember reading an article about a drill used by Pete Rose and how he would point the top of the bat at the pitching machine and would practice stopping the ball with the very end of the bat. As you can imagine the margin of error and skill required to make contact is very impressive. This drill helped him in tracking the ball to the bat and improved his hand / eye coordination.

I remember trying to bunt in the batting cage at 50 mph with the knob of the bat after reading an article about it. Take my word for it, it hurts; and probably would have even if I had had perfect contact with the ball. I can't imagine anyone doing it in a game!
 

Ken Krause

Administrator
Admin
May 7, 2008
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In my opinion, there is a big difference between hitting in a cage (whether it's inside or outside) and hitting on a field.

Think about what we tell hitters. Narrow your focus, stay within yourself. In a cage that's easier to do, because the netting automatically focuses the hitter to a narrow alley. It isolates the hitter from the rest of the world, so all she sees is the ball and place it's coming from -- whether that's a machine or a person. There is also a pretty well-defined target area to get any satisfaction out of the hit.

On the field, there is a big, wide, high background that stretches from foul pole to foul pole, plus infinite sky instead of a ceiling. In a game, there are also coaches, fielders and baserunners (hopefully!) out in front, as well as teammates and opponents in dugouts and well-meaning (mostly) parents behind or to the sides. Lots of distractions, lots of places to look around. Hitters have to force themselves to narrow their focus to the pitcher and the ball. Some are more successful at it than others.

Think of Kevin Costner in For the Love of the Game. To be focused properly, hitters have to be able to create that little tunnel -- work the mechanism. As an adult you may have discipline to do it most of the time. For a young girl it gets a lot harder, and it's not something they tend to do naturally. Remember, most are pretty conscious of body image and what other people think. Now they have all that swirling around them, in and out of their line of vision.

I think that's the challenge -- get them to create that visual cage for themselves, that enclosed environment where they feel safe and secure, and where the it's just them, the pitcher and the ball.
 

Hitter

Banned
Dec 6, 2009
651
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Maybe it is the way we teach and our approach.....

I have talked to some of the kids and parents and they see some things we do differently that collectively others pay little attention to.

We encourage our kids to keep notes on what we work on and write it down. They do it for school so do it here.

We teach them all like they have learning disabilities because until we get to know them it is difficult to determine which ones are or are not and this may separate what we do that gets the teaching across.

We teach and measure a big zone in front of a mirror so they can see how keeping the hands inside the ball actually works and see the tilt and turn and how it relates to their mechanics during the swing

Balance (is taught in front of a mirror so they can see it, feel it and fix it and during entire lesson they see their self)

Head down at contact (stronger with the head down verses up)

Throwing first (intro weight shift) floor is marked and side ways throws first and then grounders next to teach flowing to the ball on the balls of the feet

Grip they are taught leverage and how to use a $7 dollar hammer before they swing a bat

Stance ( they pick it so they get a good two eyed look) head is up right and not leaning over, no pre load and no leaning backwards

All of our kids stride (eversion and we start with shoes off to see it and feel it)

Stance width is 1.5 width of shoulders plus or minus 2 inches

Net is marked for target area to hit in

Tee is marked for zones to hit the ball from every time

Helmet is on during practice because it is in a game so get use to it! Check helmets to see if it is loose or distracting and fits correctly and we encourage using the open mask verses the basket type.

Rope drill so they feel what it is like to have the elbow and hand stacked and then what it feels like to to and tilt and where the feel stronger as to the elbow in too close or too far away.

Sequence, measure off from the plate at the back corner of the length of the bat, bend at the waist and soften the knees get a good two eyed look and tap the back of the helmet to set the bat angle so the bottom hand is at the top of the shoulder.

Hitting up the middle first for bat control, opposite field and then inside and explaining rotating as needed based on the pitch and using face the fire drill right after throwing and then the hand over drill, timing and rhythm during soft toss and tracking the ball by looking through the net verses starring at the ball on a tee.

Slow to load and soft to step and separate hands rearwards at during or before toe touch

Matrix drill, ready, set, separate to toe touch elbows, start the turn, knob parallel to contact and hand stacked over the forearm, contact and through to extension and finish. Elbow is above the hands and hands are above the bat head and it makes no difference if it is a rise or a drop it is to what degree or angle.

When to load is when the pitcher is in the K position and when to toe touch is at or during the pitchers window of release and I make that judgment based on their athleticism . This is done with them looking in a mirror and me being a pitcher while I stand behind them in the mirror and toss a rag into the mirror.

Vision training is introduced by doing the, pencil drill and then the card drills and if they want to take it a step more the bead drill. Many of our kids have Flash Focus

That is not all of it however we usually do not have a problem going form the tee to the field.

Thanks Howard
 
Aug 8, 2008
66
0
I have a couple of questions related to this discussion: How does everyone teach their hitters to prepare for an at bat? What should they be doing from dugout to plate? What should they be doing between pitches?

For example, something I see all the time is a batter in the on deck circle timing the pitcher. All too often the batter will be more or less facing the pitcher and timing her swing to the ball passing in front of her. This means she is timing her swing to a point about half way between the release and plate - essentially she will be stepping into the box with a mental image of making contact way out in front. If you doubt this watch the on deck circle at your next opportunity.

What happens next? First pitch she pulls so hard it is a fair ball in the next field over and she hopefully makes the adjustment or, more likely, she starts too early and tries to slow her swing down to keep from whiffing. If she doesn't pop up or dribble a grounder, helpful coaches and parents tell her she is late and to stop dropping her hands. So, she starts even earlier, drops her hands and repeats.

You can drill mechanics 'till the cows come home, but if the four swings you took in the on deck circle are timed to hit the ball 15 feet out in front all the good work can go out the window.
 

Hitter

Banned
Dec 6, 2009
651
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batsics said, "I have a couple of questions related to this discussion: How does everyone teach their hitters to prepare for an at bat? What should they be doing from dugout to plate? What should they be doing between pitches?"

We want the hitter to determine what they can hit and what is a ball or a strike. he only job the umpire should have to do is call safe or out and we must determine what we can hit.

Do not go to the plate thinking IF we are going to hit it but where are we going to hit it based on the defense and pitch location.

We have practiced situational hitting and being able to direct the ball off the tee based on the defensive situation present and now we must execute.

Depending on the inning we are looking for our catcher to tell us what the umpire is calling, IE; you better be swinging if it is at the knees or has not called a high pitch for a strike yet.

What is her go to pitch with a certain count.

On deck circle slow to load soft to step and while in the dugout we have mentally timed her by looking at her K position and window of release and the last three swings are hand over drills to feel that extension and drive through the ball.

Our girls will do the pencil drill by looking at the small print on a water bottle etc to warm their eyes up while in the dugout.

You must be confident in your ability and if you get on base great! If you advance the runner great!

That is their job!

Building the confidence to be able to do it is my job and their ability to execute is their job and neither of us has any control of the results only on the execution!

I think many build in excuses and provide reasons for not executing and that is what we the coach/ teacher need to be working on more in my opinion!

Thanks Howard
 
Jul 11, 2009
151
16
Any Ideas ? How do I get the girls to hit in a game the way they hit in a cage. I understand that game action adds a total different prespective. And keep in mind in the cage we vary the speed and move the ball around so its not just down the middle ever nor the same speed.

Some girls are great cage hitters but why ? is it fear of being hit or not producing ?

Any ideas or suggestions would be grealty appreciated that I could translate to my team.

Thanks BigBlue


My daughter is currently having the exact opposite problem. All winter we worked on her hitting and even visited a very good instructor a few times. She was absolutely killing the ball in the cage and during tee work. Now since school ball has started we have not had much time to work on hitting at home and for whatever reason she tells me she is having a terrible time in the cage. Her coach is really getting on her cause she can hit very few balls in the cage. But in her first 3 games she went 5-5, 5-6, and 3-4 with her first over the fence home run. I am not overly concerned that she can't hit in the cage especially when she performs well on the field. I am just concerned that whatever her coach is doing to her swing in the cage will carry over to the field. Time to set aside some time and get her working more at home.
 

Hitter

Banned
Dec 6, 2009
651
0
DaddyO

Look for whoever is feeding the machine provided they are using a machine.

Anyone who has put up the numbers she has already on the field has a timing issue IF it is in the cage only and usually the suspect is who ever if feeding the machine in my opinion.

Thanks Howard
 
Oct 19, 2009
1,821
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I’ve seen it both ways kids that hit well off a machine and struggle in a game and kids that hit well in a game and struggle hitting off a machine. Hitter had a good point on who is feeding the machine my daughter can tell at a glance if who ever is doing that is difficult to time some are better than others at having the move so the batter can time the pitch.

A thought from myself be careful if the coach is giving her a hard time not doing well in the cage it could carry over to her game performance. If a kid looses confidence in their ability it could affect her game performance. Sounds like her timing is great for life pitchers and that is the goal, tell her to keep up the good work.
 

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