Tournament Championship? But DD Didn't Play....?

[Me_and_my_big_mouth]

The championship game. Apologies for lack of clarity! (I had a thought and threw it out without thinking enough!) I'd expand what I was getting at to playing time as well. I've updated the post and hopefully it makes more sense.

Thanks for clarifying.

In my DD situation, she played a couple innings at her secondary position during pool, was lucky if she even hit during bracket, and was completely out of Championship game. This happened in several tournaments.

We gently brought it up with org President, who responded that hitting is playing; sub running is playing. We understood that point, but it didn't help when DD looked back on her team's successful season, and realized that it was her personally least successful season. She did not develop and grow as she had wanted - so back to the drawing board for the next season, work all off-season and find a team where she can have some balance.

It really is a fine line. Too much play time might result in complacency or might mean DD isn't challenged; too little and DD doesn't grow as she needs to.

Sitting one game? Be disappointed and ask what to do for next time. When sitting becomes the rule rather than exception, start evaluating other options.

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[WI Dad]

Usually though, if a kid is getting what I called bottom 9ed, this will happen will before the championship.

At 10U, and sometime 12U for a kid to get bottom 9ed isn't right, those years are more for development, maybe at 12s when you get deep into a tournament and are a high A team I can see this happening, but even then I've seen teams at least get a kid an at bat or 2.

For 14s and up it's part of the game, but you have to subjectively look. As a parent to a kid this has happened to, I ask is she getting her shot, or will she even get her shot. If she is getting bottom 9ed without getting that shot it's time to start looking for another team, if she gets her shot and doesn't preform then that falls on her shoulders.

The context of this conversation I believe goes well beyond just the championship game though.

 

[CoogansBluff]

For 14s and up it's part of the game ...

Why is it different at 14U? And should it be?

 

[WI Dad]

Cause at 10s and 12s the core focus IMO should be development first, development does happens at all ages, but starting at 14s things speed up and competitiveness starts to take over, a lot has to do with the level of play also though.

At 14s if my daughter was given her shot, didn't preform then if she's riding pine yes it sucks but she needs to use that to push her harder.

 

[obbay]

I predict this is what's going to happen with DD. She has high expectations of herself and seems confused when other girls don't feel the same.

Bingo!
same thing. and it's good that they can see the difference. the only problem is that in my case (and maybe yours) DD becomes an easy "target" because she cares so much. Do your best to have her on a team where she's happy.

 

[CoogansBluff]

Cause at 10s and 12s the core focus IMO should be development first, development does happens at all ages, but starting at 14s things speed up and competitiveness starts to take over, a lot has to do with the level of play also though.

At 14s if my daughter was given her shot, didn't preform then if she's riding pine yes it sucks but she needs to use that to push her harder.

I'm not sure that kids' needs in this regard change all that much from age 10 to 14. Do you feel that the kids themselves become more competitive as they get older and begin asking for teams like this? Or is it about coaches/adults deciding now's the time to teach them how to compete?

I'm not arguing, just thinking aloud. I was head coach of TB teams through 12U and now just watch from afar, but if I were charged with coaching a 14U or 16U team today, I don't know that I would coach it much differently than I did at 12U. I don't think that what kids look for out of travel ball changes that much as they get older. They want to play and be an integral part of a team. Yes, the older the get, the more goal-oriented they might become in terms of playing in college. But if that's the case, then development remains a priority, and they have to play to get that.

 

[grcsftbll]

Why is it different at 14U? And should it be?

I'm not sure where the cut off is, or even if it's an age or a level of play. I know our coach didn't bat 9 all fall. We had 10 (11 once, when we picked up a pitcher for a 7GG) and all played. I think at the very least through 12U everybody should get to play, if not exactly equally, at least in some fair proportion. There are kids on our team who pretty much never sit; there are kids who sit a bit more than others. But they all play and they all get to try new positions sometimes, they all hit. I approve. My DD would get more at bats if he only batted 9 but I don't care. I'm glad every girl gets the experience.

I wonder if it's less about an age and more about where they're playing. If you've got a B or C level team of 14 or 16 year olds who have no plans to play in college and are still just doing it for fun, why should it be different from 12U or 10U? But by that age with recruiting starting I can see why the divide would grow on more competitive teams, playing high level tournaments and showcases.

 

[BobInMadison]

A lot of this is different teams have different goals and different ways to get there.

There are some teams, and some organizations, who would rarely if ever sit a kid for an entire game, barring injury. Those teams usually have small rosters.

There are other teams, and other organizations, which prefer a Just Win, Baby! attitude, esp. at the older levels. These teams often have larger rosters, are often very competitive, and will often sit kids for an entire game, or sometimes for all of bracket play.

I have never put one of my DDs in an organization of the latter type. I have also made sure that my DD 3 was always one of the two best pitchers on a TB team.

That is just the way I have done it.

If you put a kid on a team with many players, and a philosophy that certain players won't see much or any playing time in bracket play, esp. for the championship game, don't be surprised if it happens.

OTOH, if you put your kid on a team that emphasizes playing all the girls every game, you have a legitimate gripe if a girl sits an entire game.

 

[Me_and_my_big_mouth]

If you put a kid on a team with many players, and a philosophy that certain players won't see much or any playing time in bracket play, esp. for the championship game, don't be surprised if it happens.

OTOH, if you put your kid on a team that emphasizes playing all the girls every game, you have a legitimate gripe if a girl sits an entire game.

Very well-stated. It is about being informed and knowing what to expect. The problems start to happen when coaches fail to communicate with players (and therefore with parents) about what they can expect and where they fit in with the team. If the player that tried out as a 3B and was accepted on the team as such is suddenly only playing 1B for an inning or two during pool and sitting for bracket, then there should certainly be some measure of explanation involved. With 14u, the girls are at a weird age where they are often too intimidated to approach coaches - but parents are expected to let the girls handle themselves. I think that can lead to all kinds of misunderstandings and frustration. As parents, we stepped back and bit our lips - and finally spoke our minds after the season was over and we were making decisions about the path forward. We were told that we should have advocated for DD sooner - which was a mixed message.

Oh well - again - there are no right/wrong answers on this, and as a parent I am aware of that. My righteous indignation could have easily been eased with a heartfelt coach-player-parent discussion that would have taken all of 20 minutes. In my old age, I've come to realize that my DD will do just about anything for a coach if she's told 1) she's wanted 2) she's worth developing and 3) there's a specific plan for her. It isn't much harder than that. She'd sit all season if a coach continued working with her to improve and had a specific set of goals and a plan.

 

[Momo'sDad]

To be a winning team, everyone must buy in. From the CEO to the janitor. You are only as strong as your weakest link.

It's rare, but occasionally, the janitor makes more than the CEO.

BART Janitor Made $270,000 in Pay and Benefits Last Year

Yes, I know my post is illegal, but I had to. I'm a total team player.