FP, Bonds does the drills for barrel control.. His game swings are not any different. His goal is to hit the top of the ball and drive it through his target, but yet knows mistakes happen ( homers ).
Swing down
- Thread starter Shawn
- Start date
Welcome to Discuss Fastpitch
Your FREE Account is waiting to the Best Softball Community on the Web.
FP, Bonds does the drills for barrel control.. His game swings are not any different. His goal is to hit the top of the ball and drive it through his target, but yet knows mistakes happen ( homers ).
The drill may be for barrel control... I have never debated that. The point myself and others are trying to make is that his barrel path in a game swing is dramatically different than the barrel path in his drill. Specifically when you watch the tip of the barrel, or even the sweet spot.
That's an interesting clip. Because in both of them, neither of them are showing anything that would lead one to see "swing down", as their hands are still at or even with their rear shoulders, and the obvious barrel barrel path is/would be coming around under the rear shoulder had it been released.
Nothing would indicate that they would have ever taken the bat/barrel over their rear shoulder "down to" the ball like some of the pros are showing, simulating, or demoing in some clips.
can you take the bat under your shoulder and still swing down? I think you can. Do some pros exaggerate it. sure.
do you think they have a different approach than say Barry or Ortiz? Staying a bit more oppo so they can stay through the zone longer? like a JD Martinez.
- Apr 11, 2015
- 877
- 63
I think that's all a matter of what one thinks is swinging down. Swing [the barrel] down from point A to point B as "some pros exaggerate" (at the expense of developing hitters)...no, I don't believe that it can be done.
Take a swing down path to the ball with the hands, while the barrel is being moved around and down away from the ball initially....yeah, most definitely possible to "take the bat under your shoulder and still swing down" in theory.
I don't believe it's "a bit more oppo" thing, but rather a get the barrel behind and in the zone earlier as JD described in that video....basically just repeating and reiterating what Ted had said 25 years earlier.
But I kind of think that all pretty much stems around their discussion at the end of the clip...
...where they talk about having different methods of instruction for different players that I definitely believe in.
Honestly, I've coached all of about 3 or 4 softball players, and maybe the fact that a rise ball is part of the game not seen in baseball, does make the true swing down plane more reasonable because of that.
Whereas in a baseball swing where the ball is for the most part going down from at or above the hitter's head (sans the couple of side-arm pitchers here and there) to a strike zone below their chests , it really makes no sense to take the same path as one would for a pitch coming up from below a hitters thighs to whatever level above them. JMO....OMMV
good points. I think softball does need a flatter plane for sure. basically all pitches are flat. the drop ball drops 4-5 inches max.
oppo does a few things for a hitter imo. Keeps them closed longer. Keeps the barrel in longer. helps them back the ball up. Later committal. Keeps the swing short.
I see the same type of swings from Tatis, Ohtani and Trout. Oppo gap intentions. hit the fastball oppo gap, release the head on off speed stuff.
I think Barry was a hit it where it’s pitched guy. some say the pitching is so good now that that’s the only way to be adjustable. what say you?
Last edited:
- Apr 11, 2015
- 877
- 63
I could have possibly said that better, but I don't believe that getting the barrel behind and in the zone earlier, is mutually exclusive with staying a bit more oppo.
In fact, I think it's a good teach to stay a bit more oppo, as it reinforces a hands inside the ball path, and helps prevent against casting that can be a concern if one only focuses on TTB, w/o some direction in mind before doing so.
IOWs, I'm more in agreement with the "launch with direction" concept, than I am with the "launch then direct" way of thinking.
IMO people get wrapped around what the barrel is doing. Thats not what it is imo. It's this move with the hands.
That little move is down to. What he does after that in the video is his interpretation of what he feels. If you feel like you throw your hands down like that, that is the fastest way to get on plane. If Trout turns his shoulders as to hit a ball there, and add in whatever tilt or whatnot. you see his game swing. That's why he practices it.
That little move is down to. What he does after that in the video is his interpretation of what he feels. If you feel like you throw your hands down like that, that is the fastest way to get on plane. If Trout turns his shoulders as to hit a ball there, and add in whatever tilt or whatnot. you see his game swing. That's why he practices it.
Last edited:
The drill may be for barrel control... I have never debated that. The point myself and others are trying to make is that his barrel path in a game swing is dramatically different than the barrel path in his drill. Specifically when you watch the tip of the barrel, or even the sweet spot.
So Your contention is Bonds hand/wrist/arm action is completely different in game swings ?
Last edited:
Nice Post Bonesaw !! These guys are attempting to maintain radial/ulnar deviation during the "down to".. Doing so helps with removing any loop in the swing.
So Your contention is Bonds hand/wrist/arm action is completely different in game swings ?
Is your contention that they are absolutely identical with no differences? The exact demo that he is performing in that clip is exactly what you want your hitters to do during a game swing?
