Senoir Night

[IndyHScoach]

Okay, let me play devil's advocate here. Why would you start a Senior over a girl who is the regular starter? That girl has worked and earned that spot.

My daughter would have set the school record for most games started if it weren't for Covid. She worked her tail off to start every game as a freshman. Had a Senior been behind her and started that game and killed her starting streak, I would have been ticked and she would have been too.

Glad that the team comes first. OH wait!

 

[bmakj]

I think what a lot of people miss when they talk about "team first", that does not mean you put winning a single game above anything else. Teams, especially HS and college teams, are also about more than one season. many people, including coaches, become blind to long term implications of decisions. you not only have to develop a team to compete this game/year, you have to develop a culture of people wanting to sacrifice for the good of the program, but you only do this by recognition of this sacrifice and dedication. If you do not do this, the program is not likely to be successful long term, because interest/participation will fade.

 

[reagansdaddy]

Glad that the team comes first. OH wait!

You don't encourage your players to have individual as well as team goals?

 

[reagansdaddy]

I think what a lot of people miss when they talk about "team first", that does not mean you put winning a single game above anything else. Teams, especially HS and college teams, are also about more than one season. many people, including coaches, become blind to long term implications of decisions. you not only have to develop a team to compete this game/year, you have to develop a culture of people wanting to sacrifice for the good of the program, but you only do this by recognition of this sacrifice and dedication. If you do not do this, the program is not likely to be successful long term, because interest/participation will fade.

I think this is an excellent point.

 

[reagansdaddy]

I am taking a bit of beating on this thread and knew that I would when I posted.

What can I say, I am a bit of a neanderthal. I've taught my kids that hard work and dedication pay off. That they shouldn't expect rewards and accolades for simply putting in time and doing the minimum. They should try to outwork everyone in whatever room they happen to be in on a given day. They should play to win and make sacrifices in order to win.

I've taught them that goal setting is a valuable exercise and that they should have individual as well as team goals. Those goals should be lofty and require work to achieve.

To me, being a starter is something that is earned - not something that's simply given away. It's valuable because it means something to be a starter because you want to help the team win.

I'm out of touch with the times, where we award participation over merit. Where we pat on the back those that simply put time in rather than squeeze out everything they can to help the team win. Where we jeopardize the actual winning of a game by starting someone who hasn't earned it and then calling the person who has earned it and desperately wants to win selfish for having the gaul to wonder if that is the best course of action.

 

[Comocoach]

I am taking a bit of beating on this thread and knew that I would when I posted.

What can I say, I am a bit of a neanderthal. I've taught my kids that hard work and dedication pay off. That they shouldn't expect rewards and accolades for simply putting in time and doing the minimum. They should try to outwork everyone in whatever room they happen to be in on a given day. They should play to win and make sacrifices in order to win.

I've taught them that goal setting is a valuable exercise and that they should have individual as well as team goals. Those goals should be lofty and require work to achieve.

To me, being a starter is something that is earned - not something that's simply given away. It's valuable because it means something to be a starter because you want to help the team win.

I'm out of touch with the times, where we award participation over merit. Where we pat on the back those that simply put time in rather than squeeze out everything they can to help the team win. Where we jeopardize the actual winning of a game by starting someone who hasn't earned it and then calling the person who has earned it and desperately wants to win selfish for having the gaul to wonder if that is the best course of action.

Having the record for most games started in high school is pretty darn close to a participation award.

 

[reagansdaddy]

Having the record for most games started in high school is pretty darn close to a participation award.

Maybe so. I don't think I said anywhere that it was her only goal. I think being a starter is a valid goal, but I'm just an idiot.

 

[bmakj]

but I highly doub they are not merely partificpating, or putting in the minimal effort, if they stuck with the team for four years. We are talking about kids who worked for four years, and simply are not as athletically talented. no way a player who does not play much is going to stick it out for four years just to get a start at the end of it all. and you can bet that they help the team out in various ways (practice, warming up pitchers, keeping score, if a senior hell just being able to help get underclassman to offseason workouts if parents cant take them, etc.). and you can bet, if the senior had not been a good teammate, worked hard, etc., the HC would have cut them at some point.

lets put it another way. take your 9 starters, send everyone else home after tryouts. how far will that team make it do you think?

it is not a participation "award", it is recognition for dedication and sacrifice (hey, if they werent a regular, why not just go quit and hang out at the mall with friends). seeing that recognition might be the thing that keeps that underclassman struggling to get on field in JV coming out, and possibly to huge improvement from year to year.

you have to look at long, intermediate, and short term goals, and factor them all in. and also remember, HS sports (and college to boot) is NOT supposed to be solely about winning. the whole purpose of scholastic athletics is to represent the school with pride, and to instill concepts of teamwork, hard work, sacrifice, school spirit.

 

[reagansdaddy]

but I highly doub they are not merely partificpating, or putting in the minimal effort, if they stuck with the team for four years. We are talking about kids who worked for four years, and simply are not as athletically talented. no way a player who does not play much is going to stick it out for four years just to get a start at the end of it all. and you can bet that they help the team out in various ways (practice, warming up pitchers, keeping score, if a senior hell just being able to help get underclassman to offseason workouts if parents cant take them, etc.). and you can bet, if the senior had not been a good teammate, worked hard, etc., the HC would have cut them at some point.

lets put it another way. take your 9 starters, send everyone else home after tryouts. how far will that team make it do you think?

it is not a participation "award", it is recognition for dedication and sacrifice (hey, if they werent a regular, why not just go quit and hang out at the mall with friends). seeing that recognition might be the thing that keeps that underclassman struggling to get on field in JV coming out, and possibly to huge improvement from year to year.

you have to look at long, intermediate, and short term goals, and factor them all in. and also remember, HS sports (and college to boot) is NOT supposed to be solely about winning. the whole purpose of scholastic athletics is to represent the school with pride, and to instill concepts of teamwork, hard work, sacrifice, school spirit.

These are all excellent points and food for thought for me. Let me ask you a question, you have talked about seniors and playing 4 years interchangeably. Would you look differently at a situation where a senior came out for the team for only a year or two and clearly was there for social rather than athletic reasons?

 

[bmakj]

These are all excellent points and food for thought for me. Let me ask you a question, you have talked about seniors and playing 4 years interchangeably. Would you look differently at a situation where a senior came out for the team for only a year or two and clearly was there for social rather than athletic reasons?

absolutely, but again, I think HC identifies that pretty quick, and cuts the girl, or maybe offers her team manager role possibly.