Screwing in foot for the Move...

[jryan15]

I'm trying to get some clarification on how to properly screw the foot into the ground to setup for the Move. I'm sure that this is wrong, but my initial impression of the sequence of screwing the foot into the ground is as follows:

1. Put the rear foot down flat with the heel down. The foot should be square to the plate or slightly toed in.
2. Position front foot in the box and get into the stance.
3. With a firm rear leg, try and rotate the rear leg clockwise (rotate at the hip not ankle or twist at the knee).

The results of this seems to be a screwed in rear foot. However instead of feeling pressure on the inside of my foot, the pressure is on the outside of my foot (almost like it wants to rollover). Now I can lift my toes and force the pressure back onto the inside of my foot to simulate what I've read to be right feeling, but I pretty sure it's not the correct way to setup.

I would really appreciate someone else's sequential description of setting up (screwing in) for the move. Many of the posts that I've read on the matter speak more in generalities and of feel, and I've had a hard time putting the correct sequence together in my mind.

 

[Stever]

Make sure the back knee stays well inside of the back foot when loading the back hip, and not drifting your knee over the top of the rear foot.

 

[Stever]

(POST REMOVED ABOUT FFS VIEW ON THE 'SCREW IN" & 'COIL')
To much information. FFS is a great swing analyzer, but as a teacher is average. The perfect combination here on this site would be to have FFS analyze the problems and have some others teach it. (and I like FFS)

'The screw in' and 'Coil' are the same thing, we are coiling the back hip by using the rear foot resistance. And please dont turn the toes upward, they should be doing the opposite- 'clawing into the ground'.

Again, you will lose all this resistance/coil on the inside of the back foot if the rear knee drifts back over the rear foot or beyond.

 

[RayR]

Whether or not you use the move....I like the back foot turned in...

 

[Wellphyt]

Ted built a berm behind his back foot when he got into the batters box so it wouldn't slip. When I played they called it "digging in". If the back foot is braced and the back leg remains firm as the batter coils their hips, some clockwise (RH batter) pressure should be felt at the back foot. Hopefully while the batter coils, their torso/head is moving forward to maintain balance, which ensures that the weight stays on the inside edge of the rear foot.

As a rule of thumb, when weight is felt on the outside edge of the rear foot, the hitter is out of balance. Probably because they haven't figured out the concept of letting the torso come forward when the front foot is lifted to coil the hips.

I suppose a batter could created some clockwise pressure at the rear foot while in their stance as a reminder to hold onto the pressure during the transition when the hips reverse.

 

[jryan15]

Fantastic feedback! Somewhere a thousand read posts ago, I had it in my head that part of doing the move was the idea of driving the knee over and maybe outside of the back foot... This is what caused the pressure to shift to the outside of the foot instead of the inside. These posts helped quite a bit!

I am now confused on what exactly the move is though... MTS in the clips that you presented, are they doing the move? Are there any good side by side clips of WITH/WITHOUT the move?

 

[Stever]

I also have the kids slightly turn the back foot in, I really think it helps them turn the hips, and in sequence.

To answer your question. YES, both hitters are coiling the back hip, watch as the back hip turns away from the plate. I think we are using the term 'Screw In', so we coil from the belly button down, and dont coil by over rotating the shoulders.

QUOTE=MTS;96830]Whether or not you use the move....I like the back foot turned in...

[/QUOTE]

 

[Wellphyt]

Fantastic feedback! Somewhere a thousand read posts ago, I had it in my head that part of doing the move was the idea of driving the knee over and maybe outside of the back foot... This is what caused the pressure to shift to the outside of the foot instead of the inside. These posts helped quite a bit!

I am now confused on what exactly the move is though... MTS in the clips that you presented, are they doing the move? Are there any good side by side clips of WITH/WITHOUT the move?

Here is an example of the Move.

The Move occurs at transition when the hips reverse from turning back to turning forward.

The action of coiling the hips creates pressure at the back foot in a clockwise direction for a RH batter and a counter clockwise direction for a LH batter. At the moment of transition when the hips reverse, you want to use the pressure created at the back foot during the coil, to reverse off of. IOW you don't want to do anything on purpose to give up the pressure at the back foot during the transition; such as lifting the back heel on purpose or turning the back knee down-and-in on purpose. If you don't do anything on purpose with the back leg to give up the pressure, the hip reversal will cause a sudden increase in pressure at the back foot just prior to eversion. The sudden increase in pressure at the transition should always be in the same direction as the pressure created during the coil.

Sometimes the pressure increase at the transition point causes the back foot to slip clockwise for a RH batter and counter clockwise for a LH batter. If the back foot doesn't slip, it's very hard to detect.

 

[tom.guerry]

a mixture of kinesiology and H-I cues:

in the elite/MLB/HLBB pattern, one cue/description is feeling the tug of war between the hip and the rear leg at the rear hip socket. The rear hip socket is one of 2 synched pivots, the hand pivot and the rear hip socket pivot.

this wrings the rag in the rear hip. hip is bottom of top, not top of bottom.

technically/kinesiologically this means that the rear hip gets and remains in IR. As maximum IR is reached there is less and less IR range of motion, but there is ongoing IR muscle force production which is felt.

This type of rear hip action supports a swing that is spatially early and very quick since it optimally recruits the elastic energy of the stretched soft tissues maximizing dependence on soft tissue elasticity and recruiting of stretch receptos refelexes producing a stretch and fire swing with early batspeed that permits late adjustability and maximum read time.

If you focus on other places and lose the rear hip location for tug of war between an IR of the rear upper leg/femur vs the hip as bottom of top, you risk losing the whole pattern with hips as top of bottom, waist separation and ER at the back hip all of which prevent stretch and fire.

See:

http://i794.photobucket.com/albums/yy225/mnbtds01/Wrongerson.gif

See IR-IR-IR vs IR-ER-IR.

Many long discussions about this here including:

- Login

Well is "aimhigh".

If this is "too technical", then maybe we can start a "technical" hitting technical forum so stever doesn't have to waste his time

 

[tom.guerry]

More rear hip IR detail for overhand throw:

Austin Wasserman Throwing - High Speed Video Thowing - YouTube

"Start watching this throw at 1:06. Pause the video at 1:15. You will see my back foot at a 45º angle, toes facing away from where I’m throwing. This will allow for maximum internal rotation of the femur in the acetabulum. From 1:15 to 1:17, my hip is forcefully driving towards my target and the weight is on the posterior side of my body meaning the heel side (not the right leg side). At 1:17 you can see how far the hip has moved from its initial position. As mentioned above, my knee is not collapsing. My femur is internally rotating in the acetabulum, not the other way around. There is no real intitial pelvic rotation. This happens later on in the sequence of the throw."

From:

Training Movement Patterns: What Sport Specificity Really Means