rise vs drop

[bigboyk]

I'll start by stating that both the drop and rise are great pitches, but the pitcher that can throw both well is a rare breed. I also know that a low fast ball is not a drop and a high fast ball is not a rise, some crazy dads don't know the difference. It seems to me that the good drop baller is very difficult to make solid contact with, and although the rise baller will get more strikeouts, they sometimes seem to get hit harder. It also appears that the strike zone has gotten lower and when disciplined batters lay off the rise it is usually a ball. Some umps don't like the knee high strike and that hurts the dropballer as well.
So, my question is , if you have 2 pitchers(16u and older), one a dropballer the other a riseballer, both throwing mid to high 50s, which one do you prefer and why???

 

[chinamigarden]

The one who gets more batters out. I don't particularly care how they got about doing it. But as long as they are effective with the pitches they throw. I'm not all that concerned about whether its a rise or a drop.

I have a girl on my team (14u) this year. She is a year older then my girl so every other year they play together. She pitches fast and is pretty accurate. At our first practice after a pitch she said, to the catcher. Oh there's my rise. So I asked her to show me her grip, she shows me a basic 4 seam grip, how do you release your rise? What do you mean she says. Well whats the difference between your rise ball and your fast ball. The rise ball is a fastball that is high she tells me.

So I asked her who told her that. She names the HS coach. Oh boy.

 

[Coach-n-Dad]

IMO, Strikeouts is not necessarily the goal for a pitcher. My DD's Gold Coach suggested to her that the perfect inning is 3 pitches.

That being said; for younger pitchers I prefer one that can throw a drop. Low pitches that get hit generally will stay on the ground and high pitches that get hit go in the air. My DD has a saying "Low and down or up and out".

 

[sluggers]

Generally, riseball pitchers are much better than drop ball pitchers against inferior batters. Inexperienced batters who haven't seen riseballs are dead meat. They can't even touch the ball. Against HS batters, riseball pitchers are goddesses. As the batters become more experienced and adept at handling riseballs, riseball pitchers start becoming less effective. Against very good batters, riseball pitchers are less effective than dropball pitchers.

The good and bad with a drop is that the pitcher gets a lot of ground balls. The odds say that a few of those will get through the infield, and so a drop ball pitcher will end up with runners on base. But, when a pitcher makes a mistake and the drop ball doesn't drop, it is low fastball--which is not a bad pitch to throw. So, a good drop pitcher will force the other team to play "base-by-base" softball. If your defense is weak, you will be in trouble.

The good of a rise is that the pitcher gets lots of popups and flyballs. Those are the easiest outs. But, when a pitcher makes a mistake and the rise doesn't rise--the ball will end up out of the park. Additionally, if the pitcher telegraphs the pitch or the batter guesses correctly, good batters can murder even good rise balls in girls and women's fastpitch. Basically, a riseball in girls softball is "flat" through the strike zone. So, if a batter can get "on top of the ball" and make a level swing, batters are going to hit it hard.

 

[Momo'sDad]

(10u rec)

When my pitchers get hit, I prefer ground balls.

 

[Mrek]

IMO, Strikeouts is not necessarily the goal for a pitcher. My DD's Gold Coach suggested to her that the perfect inning is 3 pitches.

That being said; for younger pitchers I prefer one that can throw a drop. Low pitches that get hit generally will stay on the ground and high pitches that get hit go in the air. My DD has a saying "Low and down or up and out".

While many coaches feel they have great defense, brining the eight other fielders into play causes a string of events to be executed well to get outs. Often times these events (effort, catch, throw, another catch for ground balls) are routine, sometimes not.

From the offensive side, the perfect play is a HR. There is only one defender to beat, the pitcher. And the play generates 1 guaranteed run.

From the defensive side the perfect play is a K. Nearly 100% of the time, a run cannot be scored on a K (I stress the word nearly). The hypothetical perfect inning will always be 3 K's on 9 pitches.

It is rare that, during her career, a pitcher will find herself on top flight defensive team all of the time. Generally, at some point, pitchers will find they need to figure out how to generate more K's and fewer balls in play in order to generate more Wins.

While stikeout totals may not be a goal, a minimal strikeout to walk ratio of 3 or more should be a goal. The higher that ratio is, the more Wins you will get.

Now, travel coaches are trying to manage the tournament, where it's common to play 5 games in a day to win. But in the context of any game, K's rule.

 

[starsnuffer]

As a travel coach, if I can get a groundball out on a second pitch, I'll take that all day long to a 6 pitch strikeout.

-W

 

[CoachScott]

I agree with Mrek. The perfect inning, per se, is 9 pitches, 3 Kills. Now I only coach rec, would love to move up to travel ball but not many teams around here. I only know of 2. But any way I digress. I do not want and offensive player putting a bat on the ball, to many variables after the bal is hit. Perfect inning 3 K's, everytime.

 

[chinamigarden]

Speaking as a pitcher's dad. I love to see those Ks. But as a coach I would rather see 3 easy outs, regardless of how they come. 3 pitches and 3 outs I will take over 3ks. It keeps her fresh for the later innings, maybe she might have to pitch in game 2 of a doubleheader. Or pitch in 2 more games that day. One of the most important numbers (in my opinion) to track on a pitcher is average pitches per inning. Those fast easy innings bring that number down and make a pitcher more efficient. The team goal is outs, not Ks.

 

[Jojo]

quick fast innings also take the wind out of the sails of opposing teams, they never get their excitement and focus up.
Always just getting ready to go back and take the field.
Even with a strike out pitcher, you can get your excitement up as you watch your hitter battle.

When my DD was in 18U she pitched against Abbott. It really was a great and exciting game, even though Monica pitched a 1-hitter--and that hitter never made it past 1st base!