Player Ejected-College Softball

[Rolling Hard]

People can suck at their job. There are good doctors and bad doctors. Same goes for umps, presidents, cops, CEOs, teachers and attorneys.

 

[Orange Socks]

DD's team played last weekend and the ump was not consistent for both teams. I am Sr dad and the dad next to me is Fr Dad. He had to say something on every pitch that he didn't think was correct. It was exhausting for me sitting next to him but he's a good dude. I am at the end of softball journey and I don't have the energy to complain about every pitch. Now if we are talking about missing calls in the field then I might get a little loud and then simmer down which might happen a few times in a game.

 

[The Man In Blue]

That ump totally overstepped. Even with that "rule" (which is suspect, 1A).

Umps should not go looking for trouble, listening to private conversations, and pushing boundaries.

Why do you assume that was the case? How do you know the language was not inappropriate, the comment was not directed at the umpire, or that the girl was not overly loud or aggressive with it? I would say if the umpire heard it during a rain delay, one of those things is true.

On another forum a newer umpire posted a thread about a kid who was very specific and aggressive with his language after a call, but was not facing the umpire or being loud about it. The umpire noticed it the first time and let it go. The second time the kid did it, he was even louder and more aggressive, causing his own removal from the game. The kid contended he did nothing wrong because "he was talking to himself."

We do understand that competition can get heated. We do understand that a player sometimes needs some space to vent. That does not excuse the language or the aggression. Those are not tolerable.

All you know is a couple lines posted through a social platform that came to you third- or forth- hand ... and of course, the umpire "overstepped" by enforcing the rules. And you think umpires have an "I can do no wrong" attitude ...

 

[Cougars]

Why do you assume that was the case? How do you know the language was not inappropriate, the comment was not directed at the umpire, or that the girl was not overly loud or aggressive with it? I would say if the umpire heard it during a rain delay, one of those things is true.

On another forum a newer umpire posted a thread about a kid who was very specific and aggressive with his language after a call, but was not facing the umpire or being loud about it. The umpire noticed it the first time and let it go. The second time the kid did it, he was even louder and more aggressive, causing his own removal from the game. The kid contended he did nothing wrong because "he was talking to himself."

We do understand that competition can get heated. We do understand that a player sometimes needs some space to vent. That does not excuse the language or the aggression. Those are not tolerable.

All you know is a couple lines posted through a social platform that came to you third- or forth- hand ... and of course, the umpire "overstepped" by enforcing the rules. And you think umpires have an "I can do no wrong" attitude ...

My guess would be to agree with you. This feels more like a "private" conversation between player and parent (discussed loud enough for all to hear), and not an actual private discussion that the ump happened to hear.

 

[Sweet Lou]

Without being there I have no idea for sure. But I tend to agree with Cougars that this was conversation meant for the umps to hear disguised as a talk with mom and dad during the delay.

 

[daywalkerdad]

I do not think it matters. If they heard it they heard it, if they sucked they sucked still does not excuse the player.

Example

A parent of #15 sitting sitting behind the fence. Before the game the umps get together 10’ away and are talking. The parent hears the umps say #15 really sucks at catching be ready so you do not get hit. #15 really does suck.
Parent of 15 would more than likely confront the ump or file a complaint with the tournament director. Willing to bet a majority would expect the ump to be removed.

 

[CoachJD]

In my opinion it does not matter how bad the ump is. They have been hired to do a job. As long as they are doing the job to the best of their ability they deserve respect.
Would it matter if the ump told a player they sucked after striking out, even if the player was bad?

You seem to have missed the part where she wasn't talking to the umpires.

Now, we don't know if this was an umpire with rabbit ears, just a guy looking for trouble, or if she was a little too loud or maybe doing one of those "Hey, I wasn't even talking to you!" passive-aggressive comments where she was technically talking to someone else, but saying it loudly enough so he could hear it. Or maybe it was a total fluke where she was just talking to someone and he happened to be walking by at that exact moment.

What bugs me is TMIB's post. Just posting the rules implies that because, technically, he's allowed to eject her (I don't think anybody questioned that) so that means he was right to do so. It's possible he was, but in most of the scenarios I can think of here, I think he deserves a diaper and a bottle for his response.

At the college level and above, I don't even think umpires should have the authority to eject except in the most extreme circumstances (a coach running on the field with a bat, threatening violence; a bench-clearing brawl, etc.). I think this is especially true at the MLB level, where I believe all ejections should be subject to a review by an independent panel and if the ejection isn't unanimously upheld the umpire is fined/suspended/barred from working playoff games. It's unnecessary and it just plays to the fragile egos of the thin-skinned umps. There are other ways to penalize certain behaviors within the context of the game.

At the youth level? Eh, eject us idiot coaches if we act up. We need to set a good example for the kids and a lot less should be allowed.

 

[_MIA_]

DD complains about refs/umpires sometimes but I rarely watch so I just nod and tell her both teams had the same officials…

 

[daywalkerdad]

You seem to have missed the part where she wasn't talking to the umpires.

Now, we don't know if this was an umpire with rabbit ears, just a guy looking for trouble, or if she was a little too loud or maybe doing one of those "Hey, I wasn't even talking to you!" passive-aggressive comments where she was technically talking to someone else, but saying it loudly enough so he could hear it. Or maybe it was a total fluke where she was just talking to someone and he happened to be walking by at that exact moment.

What bugs me is TMIB's post. Just posting the rules implies that because, technically, he's allowed to eject her (I don't think anybody questioned that) so that means he was right to do so. It's possible he was, but in most of the scenarios I can think of here, I think he deserves a diaper and a bottle for his response.

At the college level and above, I don't even think umpires should have the authority to eject except in the most extreme circumstances (a coach running on the field with a bat, threatening violence; a bench-clearing brawl, etc.). I think this is especially true at the MLB level, where I believe all ejections should be subject to a review by an independent panel and if the ejection isn't unanimously upheld the umpire is fined/suspended/barred from working playoff games. It's unnecessary and it just plays to the fragile egos of the thin-skinned umps. There are other ways to penalize certain behaviors within the context of the game.

At the youth level? Eh, eject us idiot coaches if we act up. We need to set a good example for the kids and a lot less should be allowed.

I do not know about the ump ejecting or just warning. Most likely it was said loud and clear since no one disputes what was said.
In this case there is one fact, a player felt the need to tell parents during a break the ump sucked. The ump may indeed need to grow up, but for 100% the player was acting like juvenile.

 

[The Man In Blue]

You seem to have missed the part where she wasn't talking to the umpires.

Can you point me to that exception in the rulebook?

What bugs me is TMIB's post. Just posting the rules implies that because, technically, he's allowed to eject her (I don't think anybody questioned that) so that means he was right to do so. It's possible he was, but in most of the scenarios I can think of here, I think he deserves a diaper and a bottle for his response.

I'm sorry that the inconvenience of the rulebook annoys you. Please, coach, which rules do want applied and which ones do you not want applied?

[sarcasm]Coach, I understand you think your player may have just hit a grand slam to win the game, but she didn't say that hit that ball for me to hear watch, so I guess it didn't happen. She's coming back to the plate and we're going to do it again. [ /sarcasm]

There has always been much debate and even much lament from umpires when the rulebook uses terms like "has the authority to" and then turns around and says "SHALL." The first gives us discretion, the second gives us direction. Mixing the two gives us trouble like this. When in doubt, err on the side of direction.

You don't like that a player very specifically and unquestionably violated the rule by making "insulting or disparaging remarks to or about opposing players or game officials," and then the umpire enforced a rule that, in the penalty section, says "If the violation occurs after the game but while the umpires are still present at the competition site, the offender shall serve a postgame 138 RULE 13 / MISCONDUCT ejection."

Sorry coach, I can't tell if you actually believe this or if you are trolling. If you don't want umpires enforcing rules, I guess quit hiring umpires for your games.