out going to second after a walk

[hooham08]

Runner on 3rd and our batter walks. She drops the bat and sprints to first and never checks up and heads to second. The umpire calls her out because the pitcher has the ball in the circle. The pitcher did have the ball and was either in the circle with one foot maybe both but not on the rubber. Coach protests to the home ump and upholds call.

I asked the ump politely between innings to confirm the ruling to me so I'd understand. He again said it was not the lookback rule and that when the pitcher has the ball in the circle before the runner reaches first she may not go towards second. not even a turn or she's out.

Is this correct?

 

[marriard]

Runner on 3rd and our batter walks. She drops the bat and sprints to first and never checks up and heads to second. The umpire calls her out because the pitcher has the ball in the circle.
He again said it was not the lookback rule and that when the pitcher has the ball in the circle before the runner reaches first she may not go towards second. not even a turn or she's out.
Is this correct?

Nope. Flat out wrong. Straight from the 'Made Up A Rule' rulebook.

 

[grcsftbll]

So many umpires seem to not get this one! For us it often goes the other way, clear violation and they will not give us the out.

 

[Comp]

You protested and the umpire upheld the call? What umpire, the one who made the original call, or the UIC that should have been summoned to issue a ruling when the protest was lodged?

Totally and completely wrong on the call, The lookback rules specifically allows for a walked batter to round first, stop and then continue to advance or return. Now, this is different than the situation asked about a week or so ago when the walked batter overruns first toward right field and then heads back to first. In that situation they would be in violation of the lookback rule.

Again, would like a little clarification as to what exactly went on with your protest and who made the ruling

 

[Silver 2200]

What age group are you talking about. I have seen rules in 8u rec and travel ball where once the ball is in the cirlce the play is dead. They usually just send the runner back to the bag they were at previously.

If that is not the case, the umpire was dead wrong.

 

[hooham08]

You protested and the umpire upheld the call? What umpire, the one who made the original call, or the UIC that should have been summoned to issue a ruling when the protest was lodged?

Totally and completely wrong on the call, The lookback rules specifically allows for a walked batter to round first, stop and then continue to advance or return. Now, this is different than the situation asked about a week or so ago when the walked batter overruns first toward right field and then heads back to first. In that situation they would be in violation of the lookback rule.

Again, would like a little clarification as to what exactly went on with your protest and who made the ruling

Ump behind ss made the out call. The coach called time and asked him to check the plate umpire. They got together and call stood. Guess that's not a protest where anyone else is involved. I believe it's a large fee to protest a game for birth certificates. I don't know if ot works the same with rules protest. This was a "got game" tourney and they use usa softball rules. I'll look more to see if they have specific add on rules.

To clarify he said the look back rule was different and this was different. I should have enquired more on it but i didn't want to agitate him as other parents were ruining the moment.

This is 10u.

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[Comp]

Ok, that isn't a protest that is simply asking one umpire to check with their partner. There is nothing different in any actual ruleset for this situation, it is legal in every ruleset. So, unless there was something tournament exclusive, then it was a bad call.

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[The Man In Blue]

So ... was he saying the pitcher didn’t look back?

USA Softball

Rule 8 - Batter runner and runner
Section 7 -The runner is out
T. (Fast pitch) LOOK BACK RULE The “Look Back” rule shall be in effect for all runners when:

1) The ball is live. Check
2) The batter-runner has reached first base or has been declared out. Check
3) The pitcher has possession and control of the ball within the pitcher’s circle. The pitcher is considered to be in the pitcher’s circle when both feet are on or within the lines. Check
(A) When a Runner is legitimately off a base after a pitch or as a result of a batter completing a turn at bat, and while the pitcher has control of the ball within the eight foot radius of the pitcher’s plate, the runner may stop once then must immediately return to the base or attempt to advance to the next base. Check
(B) Once the runner stops at a base for any reason the runner will be declared out if leaving the base.
(C) Responsibilities of the batter-runner after reaching first base, and while the pitcher has control of the ball within the eight foot radius of the pitcher’s plate, including a base on balls or a dropped third strike, are as follows:
[1] A batter runner who rounds first base toward second base may stop once, but then must immediately non-stop return to to first base or attempt to advance non-stop to second base. Check
[2] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, turns left and immediately stops, must then return non-stop to first base or attempt to advance non-stop to second base.
[3] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, turns left and moves directly toward second base and stops, is committed to second base and must advance non-stop to second base.
[4] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, turns left and moves back toward the infield in any direction except directly toward second base, is committed to first base and must return non-stop to first base.
[5] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, and turns right, is committed to first base and must return non-stop to first base.

Effect - Section 7T[A-C]
(1) The ball is dead.
(2) The runner is out.
(3) When more than one runner is off base, only one runner is called out.
(4) All other runners are returned to the last touched base.

Exception - Section 7T[A-C]: The runner will not be declared out if:
(1) A play is made in any runner. A fake throw is considered a play.
(2) The pitcher no longer has possession of the ball within th eight foot radius, or
(3) The pitcher releases the ball on a pitch to the batter.

 

[MTR]

Ump behind ss made the out call. The coach called time and asked him to check the plate umpire. They got together and call stood. Guess that's not a protest where anyone else is involved. I believe it's a large fee to protest a game for birth certificates. I don't know if ot works the same with rules protest. This was a "got game" tourney and they use usa softball rules. I'll look more to see if they have specific add on rules.

To clarify he said the look back rule was different and this was different. I should have enquired more on it but i didn't want to agitate him as other parents were ruining the moment.

This is 10u.

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Any tournament/organization which chargers for ANY protest and should be avoided.

 

[hooham08]

So ... was he saying the pitcher didn’t look back?

USA Softball

Rule 8 - Batter runner and runner
Section 7 -The runner is out
T. (Fast pitch) LOOK BACK RULE The “Look Back” rule shall be in effect for all runners when:

1) The ball is live. Check
2) The batter-runner has reached first base or has been declared out. Check
3) The pitcher has possession and control of the ball within the pitcher’s circle. The pitcher is considered to be in the pitcher’s circle when both feet are on or within the lines. Check
(A) When a Runner is legitimately off a base after a pitch or as a result of a batter completing a turn at bat, and while the pitcher has control of the ball within the eight foot radius of the pitcher’s plate, the runner may stop once then must immediately return to the base or attempt to advance to the next base. Check
(B) Once the runner stops at a base for any reason the runner will be declared out if leaving the base.
(C) Responsibilities of the batter-runner after reaching first base, and while the pitcher has control of the ball within the eight foot radius of the pitcher’s plate, including a base on balls or a dropped third strike, are as follows:
[1] A batter runner who rounds first base toward second base may stop once, but then must immediately non-stop return to to first base or attempt to advance non-stop to second base. Check
[2] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, turns left and immediately stops, must then return non-stop to first base or attempt to advance non-stop to second base.
[3] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, turns left and moves directly toward second base and stops, is committed to second base and must advance non-stop to second base.
[4] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, turns left and moves back toward the infield in any direction except directly toward second base, is committed to first base and must return non-stop to first base.
[5] A batter-runner who over-runs first base toward right field, and turns right, is committed to first base and must return non-stop to first base.

Effect - Section 7T[A-C]
(1) The ball is dead.
(2) The runner is out.
(3) When more than one runner is off base, only one runner is called out.
(4) All other runners are returned to the last touched base.

Exception - Section 7T[A-C]: The runner will not be declared out if:
(1) A play is made in any runner. A fake throw is considered a play.
(2) The pitcher no longer has possession of the ball within th eight foot radius, or
(3) The pitcher releases the ball on a pitch to the batter.

I don't disagree with you. But he says this was not a lookback rule violation. Ive emailed the director for clarity. Noi response yet. Didn't cost us. But our coach just started sending the runners to second after walks. He wasn't doing it before because he said he's had girls called out on it.. just like this situation. Looks like we're back to not doing it.

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