I'm unsure of your meaning in that statement. Can't you (you meaning anyone) be a "great coach" (I'm assuming meaning winning) AND instill those values ?
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I'm unsure of your meaning in that statement. Can't you (you meaning anyone) be a "great coach" (I'm assuming meaning winning) AND instill those values ?
You guys have watched "Knute Rockne--All American" once too often.
It is pretty silly to believe that a coach, who spends almost ZERO one on one time with a kid, teaches important "life values".
The idea of "sports teaching value" is a myth. College coaches like to use the myth as a way to attract kids to their team. Hollywood and the NCAA likes to use the myth as a way to sell tickets.
The only thing of importance a softball coach teaches is how to do run downs, field ground balls and catch pop-ups.
One of my kids started for an NCAA "coach of the year". He was an excellent coach. Did I want my kid to pattern her life after this guy? No. What did she learn from him? How to be a great basketball player--specifically, not generally. I.e., how to properly run a fast break, how to do a team defense, how to get in shape for the season.
Did she learn anything about "how to live" or "work ethic" from him? No. She learned that stuff from me and my wife.
It is pretty silly to believe that a coach, who spends almost ZERO one on one time with a kid, teaches important "life values".
The idea of "sports teaching value" is a myth. College coaches like to use the myth as a way to attract kids to their team. Hollywood and the NCAA likes to use the myth as a way to sell tickets.
The only thing of importance a softball coach teaches is how to do run downs, field ground balls and catch pop-ups.
One of my kids started for an NCAA "coach of the year". He was an excellent coach. Did I want my kid to pattern her life after this guy? No. What did she learn from him? How to be a great basketball player--specifically, not generally. I.e., how to properly run a fast break, how to do a team defense, how to get in shape for the season.
Did she learn anything about "how to live" or "work ethic" from him? No. She learned that stuff from me and my wife.
I think so too -if you dont charge for these incredible heart warming benefits.
I strongly believe that no parent should turn over his/her DDs education about life to a guy who happens to know how to do a RF to 3B relay. Further, I'm suspicious of any coach that suggests that he/she is a "moral compass" for the players.
Why? Because most successful coaches are nuttier than fruitcakes. My DDs have been cursed from one side of the softball field/basketball court to the other. They have been called names they make me, a 55 YOA man who worked for four years with sexually abused children, blush. Both played for incredibly successful coaches.
If they went into college situations believing that "coaches are moral compasses", they would have been warped beyond belief.
Why? Because most successful coaches are nuttier than fruitcakes. My DDs have been cursed from one side of the softball field/basketball court to the other. They have been called names they make me, a 55 YOA man who worked for four years with sexually abused children, blush. Both played for incredibly successful coaches.
If they went into college situations believing that "coaches are moral compasses", they would have been warped beyond belief.
I would not suggest that anyone depend on a coach to be a moral compass for their kid either. But just as there are plenty of bad ones, there are some really terriffic ones too.
Athletic competition in general teaches kids a lot about life. It teaches things sometimes dont go your way even when you put in your best effort. It teaches that you have to work even harder when you fall short of your goals. It teaches that you cant give up when things get tough. It teaches that sportsmanship, i.e. being a good human being and a fair competitor, is as important as success.
Anyone that cant see that..well I dont know what to say.
Even in the toughest , most important games, where the parents can get a little too "involved" (if not downright abusive), the girls always exhibit poise, sportsmanship, and honor. Sometimes I wonder where they got it after seeing how their parents behave.
Athletic competition in general teaches kids a lot about life. It teaches things sometimes dont go your way even when you put in your best effort. It teaches that you have to work even harder when you fall short of your goals. It teaches that you cant give up when things get tough. It teaches that sportsmanship, i.e. being a good human being and a fair competitor, is as important as success.
Anyone that cant see that..well I dont know what to say.
Even in the toughest , most important games, where the parents can get a little too "involved" (if not downright abusive), the girls always exhibit poise, sportsmanship, and honor. Sometimes I wonder where they got it after seeing how their parents behave.
*** I WHOLE HEARTEDLY believe that there are OUTSTANDING youth, HS, College AND professional coaches that do in-fact teach morals..... Joe Paterno (7 years of coaches clinics at Penn State) and Mike Candrea are 2 of my favorites, because they care about their players education and growing as young adults, they truly do.
*** Penn State coach Larry Johnson (LJ's dad) NEVER CURSES or yells AT his players. He is positive, talks about being good christians and treats his players as men, and is one of the BEST Defense Coaches in the country! I've been fortunate to be at many clinics with Coach Johnson and think he is one of the best coaches in the country - PERIOD! If yu go to Penn State, you'd be surprised to se how RESPECTFUL the football players are!!
ME??? My players hear me ALL the time checking on their grades and preachinig respect to not only their players and coaches, but parents! I tell the parents straight up, I'm NOT your child's parent, BUT I decide if they play and if I hear disrespect, bad grades, getting in trouble...... they won't play - MY Call!
The coach I coach with now in travel ball has the same philosophy, he insists on the girls being respectful and often talks about always doing the right thing/making the right decisions, being involved in the communiity and he's extremely successful. Coach at HS (footall coach also) NEVER yells or curses at his players and talks about family values!
I had 5 DIV1 football players last season that played for me for a couple years of youth football (12-14 yrs old). You know they ALL will tell you as many of my players will tell you the 1st thing they say to me when I say hello "I'm doing well in school coach!" or "I'm getting good grades!" I'm sure you've had players come back to you as they went off to college or were seniors needing letters; we all have. I preach family/religion and school ALL come before the sport (whatever order your family puts those in) becuase these are
all aspects of life that provide balance and support long after the sport ends. My players have never seen me drunk, curse or taking bad about others. Herman Edwards and Tony Dungy are excellent examples of professional coaches that care for their players, the players families and being positive role models.
I used to mentor for a few years to grammer and middle school students and as these kids become teenagers and early 20s, its great to talk with them, seeing they are working hard to be good people, same as most of our players - good kids who work hard ini college and becoming productive citizens. I do believe that ALTHOUGH there are MANY coaches who do NOT care about players and ONLY about winning, there are a good amount of coaches that truly do care for their players welfare!
*** Penn State coach Larry Johnson (LJ's dad) NEVER CURSES or yells AT his players. He is positive, talks about being good christians and treats his players as men, and is one of the BEST Defense Coaches in the country! I've been fortunate to be at many clinics with Coach Johnson and think he is one of the best coaches in the country - PERIOD! If yu go to Penn State, you'd be surprised to se how RESPECTFUL the football players are!!
ME??? My players hear me ALL the time checking on their grades and preachinig respect to not only their players and coaches, but parents! I tell the parents straight up, I'm NOT your child's parent, BUT I decide if they play and if I hear disrespect, bad grades, getting in trouble...... they won't play - MY Call!
The coach I coach with now in travel ball has the same philosophy, he insists on the girls being respectful and often talks about always doing the right thing/making the right decisions, being involved in the communiity and he's extremely successful. Coach at HS (footall coach also) NEVER yells or curses at his players and talks about family values!
I had 5 DIV1 football players last season that played for me for a couple years of youth football (12-14 yrs old). You know they ALL will tell you as many of my players will tell you the 1st thing they say to me when I say hello "I'm doing well in school coach!" or "I'm getting good grades!" I'm sure you've had players come back to you as they went off to college or were seniors needing letters; we all have. I preach family/religion and school ALL come before the sport (whatever order your family puts those in) becuase these are
all aspects of life that provide balance and support long after the sport ends. My players have never seen me drunk, curse or taking bad about others. Herman Edwards and Tony Dungy are excellent examples of professional coaches that care for their players, the players families and being positive role models.
I used to mentor for a few years to grammer and middle school students and as these kids become teenagers and early 20s, its great to talk with them, seeing they are working hard to be good people, same as most of our players - good kids who work hard ini college and becoming productive citizens. I do believe that ALTHOUGH there are MANY coaches who do NOT care about players and ONLY about winning, there are a good amount of coaches that truly do care for their players welfare!
when I reference myself, I am only ackowledging that I understand I am not experienced as many coaches in the forum. I believe there are MANY great coaches at ALL levels of play that ABSOLUTELY install values.
Joe Paterno / Mike Candrea / Tony Dungee / Herman Edwards / Coach Larry Johnson..... great coaches w/ winning records AND they all install values and morals.... there are decisions Paterno AND Candrea have made based on discipline, although it wasn't what was best for the team and in Paterno's case, he lost a BOWL game one year W/O one of his top offensive players because he knew his grades were not there, so he wouldn't let him go to the Bowl game.... he didn't need to TRACK the grades and the GPA would not have come out until AFTER the game, but he did .....
- Oct 19, 2009
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While I agree that parents should not rely on coaches to teach values to their children, I strongly disagree that coaches are incapable of teaching them.
I will never forget Bill Curry, my baseball coach from the age of 10-12. Mr. Curry was a tough SOB just like my dad. There were days during games and practice that I despised this man. You bet he taught us how to hit, field, run, and handle situations. If all the fields were booked by other teams for practice, we went to his farm where he had a homemade pitching machine set up in the cornfield and we would hit and shag for hours.
On our team, we had to earn our hats and uniforms. If we hadn't earned them we would scrimmage other teams with no uniforms.
How is this teaching values? He spent a lot of time talking to us about having to "have a desire to win". If we lost a game because we didn't do what we'd been taught, yea we heard about it. If we lost a game because we played our butts off and still came up short to a better team, he told us to keep our heads up. This didn't happen much though because he taught us to be winners. Every year I played on his team we won championships whether it was league or tournaments.
I know in today's world of political correctness it seems to be a great evil to emphasize winning in youth athletics. For me that was almost 30 years ago. The boys who had little talent or ability under Mr. Curry became adequate players. Those who did have talent went on to be stars in High School, many advancing to the collegiate level. The life lesson is so simple yet lost on so many: anything worth having (including wins and championships) must be earned through hard work. Life is competition. Be it grades, getting into a good college, getting a good job, promotions, business, contracts, etc. I think a lot of kids are cheated today because they are never taught work ethics all the while their parents, teachers, and coaches try to uphold their self-esteem. It's a terrible lie.
For those days I hated Mr. Curry I wouldn't trade those days of my life for anything. I was one who went on to play in college, got a few pro try outs, and played for a lot of good coaches. None made them impact on my life that Mr. Curry did. Mr. Curry has since passed away, but his lessons live on with me and many others that he coached.
- Oct 19, 2009
- 638
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Oh yeah, we never took family vacations during baseball season either - no regrets. Mom and dad went to all my games.
Now I coach girls softball and we take our vacations during mid August.
Funny thing, last year one of my daughters played on a travel team and both of her coaches took vacation in the middle of the season! My wife and I totally had a cow.
Even funnier, my youngest girl tried out for a 9U team and on the application form it even asked if we planned to take any vacations from the beginning of May to the beginning of August. I wrote "No, we are a softball family!"
Now I coach girls softball and we take our vacations during mid August.
Funny thing, last year one of my daughters played on a travel team and both of her coaches took vacation in the middle of the season! My wife and I totally had a cow.
Even funnier, my youngest girl tried out for a 9U team and on the application form it even asked if we planned to take any vacations from the beginning of May to the beginning of August. I wrote "No, we are a softball family!"
Something to think about, NOT to instigate arguments.
does that mean EVERY girl or her family should have that love for the sport to that degree? I used to coach 7 days a week, 2-3 teams a year, girls from 4-5 HSs and for hours every night. I attended 4-5 clinics EVERY Year (Including flying to Arizona and OKC every year!), talk softball half the day and always learning (I'm just barely learning how to SPELL Softball and don't have nearly HALF the experience of some of the very good coaches that talk in this forum.)
I love the game that much, but have often been reminded not EVERYONE loves softball like I do.
** Many familes go to church EVERY WEEK, SOME go 2X on Sundays! (thats new to me here, but true.), so should THEY feel / insist EVERYONE should go to church EVERY WEEK or 2X EVERY SUNDAY? who is to say they are wrong? They aren't, BUT because they have that love for their religion and THAT COMMITMENT, should they feel EVERYONE SHOULD?
** Or is it ok to love the game so much, you schedule vacations around the season, BUT if a family or player that loves to play, BUT NOT to that degree, shouldn't be allowed to play travel ball? Depends on the team and hopefully they understand that commitment before agreeing to play on a team if she makes it.
**--**--**Please, just try and at least understand that some players don't have a choice about family vacations and some actually do prioritize their immediate family over their softball family.
does that mean EVERY girl or her family should have that love for the sport to that degree? I used to coach 7 days a week, 2-3 teams a year, girls from 4-5 HSs and for hours every night. I attended 4-5 clinics EVERY Year (Including flying to Arizona and OKC every year!), talk softball half the day and always learning (I'm just barely learning how to SPELL Softball and don't have nearly HALF the experience of some of the very good coaches that talk in this forum.)
I love the game that much, but have often been reminded not EVERYONE loves softball like I do.
** Many familes go to church EVERY WEEK, SOME go 2X on Sundays! (thats new to me here, but true.), so should THEY feel / insist EVERYONE should go to church EVERY WEEK or 2X EVERY SUNDAY? who is to say they are wrong? They aren't, BUT because they have that love for their religion and THAT COMMITMENT, should they feel EVERYONE SHOULD?
** Or is it ok to love the game so much, you schedule vacations around the season, BUT if a family or player that loves to play, BUT NOT to that degree, shouldn't be allowed to play travel ball? Depends on the team and hopefully they understand that commitment before agreeing to play on a team if she makes it.
**--**--**Please, just try and at least understand that some players don't have a choice about family vacations and some actually do prioritize their immediate family over their softball family.
