Armwhip brings up a good point about how some pitchers use their wrist. The grip that some of them use is "similar" to that shown on the cover of Ernie Parker's rise video. Now I consider myself to have an ok riseball but even I cannot throw a backspin rise with this grip or by making SLIGHT variations. I need to make several changes to even control the ball. Now, I'm not saying that this grip cannot work! I'm just saying that when I tried to use it, it promoted a flawed wrist action in my own pitching which ruined my spin. I know a lot of girls use this grip (or try to) for their rise. In my opinion, this grip negates the finger action and puts too much wrist into it. When too much wrist is used, the fingers do not turn the right way creating side or bullet spin.... especially when you factor in mechanics where the hips are not cleared by the ball.
Rick, I don't doubt you that both Abbott and Finch could have some 'lift' to their pitches. Anything thrown without downspin will fight against gravity so to speak. Finch should have an easier time throwing a 'low rise' because she gets the sideways sidepin on the ball. Abbott gets too much bullet spin for my taste. I don't know of too many pitchers who can throw a low rise (consistently) with straight backspin. There's too much danger of it going 'up' too much and staying in the middle of the zone. But putting a slight sidespin too it (as Finch's mechanics would do) would possibly add the right mix of both. But, I still don't think she's getting under the ball for a "riseball" by my defintion. And YES, I do realize I'm more picky than most.
bill
Bill
I don't think I've seen any ladies with pure 12/6 backspin on their riseball. I have seen many that have something near 11/5 and it does jump pretty significantly with this orientation; especially if they have 4 seams at spinning at that orientation.
What is it about your grip that produces 12/6 backspin? Are you getting the 4 seam spin orientation?
Back in my day (which was not at an elite level of pitching) I used the tucked finger tip grip and had a decent riseball. But when I view it now my rotation is very similar to what I see on the ladies. Wrist action is similar and other than the "spring loaded effect" the tucked finger tip provides, the rest of the finger action is very similar.
Have you got any frame by frame pics that we could compare?