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FiveFrameSwing said:

The term 'launch' shouldn't muddy the process.

When you throw an object maximum speed is generally at 'release'.

I tell my hitters that I want them to 'release' into & through impact.

The word 'launch' as used by 1CA is simply 'release' ... and if the goal is to hit the ball at maximum barrel speed, then you'll want to be in the process of 'releasing' ... or 'launching'.

Personally I use the word 'release' with my hitters. However I can readily identify with 1CA's use of 'launch'.

As for 'direction' ... it is essential IMO. I'll pitch to my hitters and ask that they attempt to identify 'inside' or 'outside' as quickly as possible (no bat involved in this drill). The goal is for them to identify the ball as being 'inside' or 'outside' within the first third of the distance the ball travels. How you use your eyes helps. A relaxed open focus can allow a hitter to back-plane and more quickly identify inside/outside. The notion is to leave this drill with the message of being responsible for quickly identifying the incoming pitch location in terms of 'inside' or 'outside'.

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The 'mud' is simply due to the multiple definitions of the term. And more of a forum mud than anything else. Coincidentally, I do a drill similar to what you are suggesting above. Only I will have our hitters stand in the box while our pitchers are throwing bullpen sessions. The catcher will call pitches and locations. The hitters job initially is to identify inside/outside as well as speed/off speed. After a few reps, I ask them to start timing the ball with their back leg. Essentially a check swing without doing much with the bat. Just to get the timing and location pieces coordinated. Develop the 'feel'.

Get the right feel

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Buttermaker said:

Learning to rotate the forearms correctly to TTB is step one. If you can't do that swinging with your back makes no sense.

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Not IMO ... step one is the torso-engine ... step two would be the hands. Then a hitter can feel how the barrel action induced by the hands/forearms resists the forward pulling movement of the torso/hip-engine.

That said ... we've seen pros demo a two-stage progression drill where they take care of the hands first and the torso-engine second.

rdbass said:

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Reminds me of the split-grip drill ... where the intent was to help differentiate the feel associated with the top hand throwing process.

FP26 said:

The 'mud' is simply due to the multiple definitions of the term. And more of a forum mud than anything else. Coincidentally, I do a drill similar to what you are suggesting above. Only I will have our hitters stand in the box while our pitchers are throwing bullpen sessions. The catcher will call pitches and locations. The hitters job initially is to identify inside/outside as well as speed/off speed. After a few reps, I ask them to start timing the ball with their back leg. Essentially a check swing without doing much with the bat. Just to get the timing and location pieces coordinated. Develop the 'feel'.

Click to expand...

Regarding the bold portion ... I do something similar ... but the timing is with the torso (preparing to pull) and the check swing is performed with the start of the torso-engine ... which I want eventually felt as a 'twitch' ... I want my hitters to 'twitch at the ball' ... the notion is to work on being reactionary.

julray said:

Had her do the throwing drill tonight.. and then take about 20 reps, WOW. Short hands, no shirt... what an improvement. Wish I seen this one earlier in the season. Great drill!..

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I had another hitter perform that drill last night. For this particular kid the hitter had to learn how the torso pulls on the lead arm and that during that initial pull the lead arm was not trying to move forward, but is instead being pulled forward, and that during that initial pull the bottom hand is going from an upright handshake orientation towards a palm-down orientation ... i.e., the lead arm is in a leveling process during the initial torso pulling phase.

FiveFrameSwing said:

The term 'launch' shouldn't muddy the process.

When you throw an object maximum speed is generally at 'release'.

I tell my hitters that I want them to 'release' into & through impact.

The word 'launch' as used by 1CA is simply 'release' ... and if the goal is to hit the ball at maximum barrel speed, then you'll want to be in the process of 'releasing' ... or 'launching'.

Personally I use the word 'release' with my hitters. However I can readily identify with 1CA's use of 'launch'.

As for 'direction' ... it is essential IMO. I'll pitch to my hitters and ask that they attempt to identify 'inside' or 'outside' as quickly as possible (no bat involved in this drill). The goal is for them to identify the ball as being 'inside' or 'outside' within the first third of the distance the ball travels. How you use your eyes helps. A relaxed open focus can allow a hitter to back-plane and more quickly identify inside/outside. The notion is to leave this drill with the message of being responsible for quickly identifying the incoming pitch location in terms of 'inside' or 'outside'.

Click to expand...

Let me just say this wrt it all, and all of the different names being given redefined or whatever...

When you "launch" something, it's usually understood that whatever it is you're launching, has already been "loaded", and aimed at whatever it is you're launching it at before you hit the "GO!" button. However, when you "release" something, it usually means that you're simply letting it go after whatever travels or direction(s) it's already gone to arrive at the point of release.

So when someone tries to take a longstanding baseball/hitting term of bat/barrel "release", and redefine it to fit a new or personal theory of how to swing a bat, I too think it muddies the waters, and to try to justify it just to make friendlies, but then say you use the original, or should I same "common" hitting term...does nothing to help alleviate the confusion caused be these types of redefining of terms.

The biggest question/concern should be where you want your players to "launch" the swing, bat, or barrel (whichever word one wants to choose there).

But to say that there is a "swing launch", and then that somewhere down the line after that there is another loading process, and "barrel launch" is just hitting terminology hocus-pocus to backpedal oneself out of a theory that makes no sense to those who've been reading, learning, and following the hitting theories of the great(s) for long, long time. JMHO obviously...OMMV.

And no, that is not the only common term to be redefined recently (there's been plenty unfortunately), but again, IMO only...might just be the one that has cause the most confusion, arguments, and angst on these hitting boards over the past several years. Just sayin'....

FP26 said:

The 'mud' is simply due to the multiple definitions of the term. And more of a forum mud than anything else.

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I hate to do this, but I'm going to have to ask you to find another term other than my forums registered trademark "mud". It's recent usage(s) is/are bordering on slander, and libel...and I'd hate to have to get my lawyers involved. You seem like a very nice person, and I don't want to sound like a bully, but enough is enough already!!

I kid, I kid!!! For those who don't know it...FP26, and I go back a long way now at these forums, and I've always admired his levelheadedness, calm demeanor, and knowledge of hitting, and just the game in general. If it were anyone else who wrote that (OK, maybe a couple others might have gotten it also ) I wouldn't have joked like that...but be he knows (or should know) it's all in fun, good humor, and that I respect his thoughts, advice, opinion, and instruction greatly. =)

Mudders Brudder said:

Let me just say this wrt it all, and all of the different names being given redefined or whatever...

When you "launch" something, it's usually understood that whatever it is you're launching, has already been "loaded", and aimed at whatever it is you're launching it at before you hit the "GO!" button. However, when you "release" something, it usually means that you're simply letting it go after whatever travels or direction(s) it's already gone to arrive at the point of release.

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Help me understand your perspective a bit more.

What exactly is being 'loaded' prior to 'swing launch'?

I'm completely serious. A common issue I run into with young hitters is a faulty pre-load prior to 'swing launch'.

I personally teach more of a 'relaxed/low-tension' type preparation to swing. Sure ... the rear leg is 'loaded' ... but not the 'arms', etc ... and that is where a lot of young kids get into trouble and develop habits that are difficult for them to break. To me it is completely understandable how loading takes place 'at' and 'just after' 'swing launch' ... as a result of 'swing launch'.

I am open to a better understanding.

FiveFrameSwing said:

Regarding the bold portion ... I do something similar ... but the timing is with the torso (preparing to pull) and the check swing is performed with the start of the torso-engine ... which I want eventually felt as a 'twitch' ... I want my hitters to 'twitch at the ball' ... the notion is to work on being reactionary.

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Very nice... I see it as a twitch as well. Being reactionary is extremely important. Good stuff Five.