Pitching speeds

[FiveFrameSwing]

Thanks Guys,

That helped clear things up. Could you send this to Michelle Smith

This was the first year I didn't hear Michele babble about a riseball having late upwards breaking motion. Last year I felt bad for her, as she'd babble about a late northward breaking riseball, and then the K-zone results would be displayed making her sound foolish ... and she didn't have the common sense to realize that she was not describing what was being shown. At least this year she clammed up on the topic. Now if we can just get Hal educated on the topic also.

 

[sluggers]

I get tired of posting about the whole "rise ball" debate, but I'm trying to help the newbies.

One goal of the whole 'do rise balls really rise" is to allow newbies to identify a "real" rise. A rise thrown around 55 to 65 MPH has a simple flight path...there is a relatively high trajectory at the beginning followed by a flat trajectory as it crosses the plate. It is a very distinctive flight path. Once you understand what it is supposed to look like, you can stand at 3B or 1B and easily see if the kid is really throwing a rise instead of a high fastball.

This nonsense about the "jumping" rise ball is misleading and needlessly complicates the learning process.

 

[Get-n-Go]

I agree, a lot of the slo mo replays in the WCWS were showing bullet spin coming out of the pitchers hand. Hardly correct spin for a rise or any other pitch.

 

[Ken B]

Michele Smith="Newbie"?

 

[Ken B]

I agree, a lot of the slo mo replays in the WCWS were showing bullet spin coming out of the pitchers hand. Hardly correct spin for a rise or any other pitch.

Tell that to anyone who had to face Luna or Escobedo!

 

[Rocketech1]

Rocketech1, rise balls don't drop. Get it through your head.

How about educating yourself a little. Rise balls drop from their initial plane of trajectory because of the effects of drag and gravity on the ball. The reason rise balls are an effective pitch is because they don't drop as much as any other pitch the batter may face and the fact it is thrown with back spin not top spin or side spin like the other pitches and it is thrown from a low to high trajectory.

Sluggers is absolutely correct and the recent ESPN video show the rise ball with an initial upward trajectory and flattening out (dropping) as it reaches the plate. It you have any video that refutes this, please post we would all love to see it.

 

[sluggers]

Ken...Michelle Smith is a talented athlete and did a lot for the sport. She basically parrots what she was told 30 years ago. When high speed cameras show that she is wrong, she ignores it or doesn't see it.

They had a closeup of the hand when a kid was throwing a drop. As we've discussed about 1,000,000 times here, the hand is behind the ball at release. After release, the hand turned over. Michelle just ignored the video and kept on talking about the hand going over the ball. It was a lot like watching a dubbed movie where the voice doesn't go with the video.

She talks about the "hop" on the ball. They put up a flight path on the screen of the ball, and there is no hop. I guess she doesn't watch the videos.

 

[JDBerry]

Ken...Michelle Smith is a talented athlete and did a lot for the sport. She basically parrots what she was told 30 years ago. When high speed cameras show that she is wrong, she ignores it or doesn't see it.

They had a closeup of the hand when a kid was throwing a drop. As we've discussed about 1,000,000 times here, the hand is behind the ball at release. After release, the hand turned over. Michelle just ignored the video and kept on talking about the hand going over the ball. It was a lot like watching a dubbed movie where the voice doesn't go with the video.

She talks about the "hop" on the ball. They put up a flight path on the screen of the ball, and there is no hop. I guess she doesn't watch the videos.

Ugh! Such bad info.

The hand rolls over the ball on a roll drop. It's not debatable. I don't even understand questioning it. In some of the grips a 12yo kid could not release the ball with the hand behind.

Of course, I'm sure an a record holding SEC pitcher doesn't know what she's talking about and you saw one video and do. There is a pitch that's thrown where the hand rides up the back outside of the ball. But on a rollover drop the ball is leaving when the thumb is pointing kinda to the knee

 

[Ken B]

sluggers,
Just poking fun. I love her enthusiasm and how much she puts in to this sport, but I do hope she continues to improve her knowledge and commentary.

Out in Left Field,
I've only seen a couple replays (or full games for that matter.) Who was getting good spins? I got to see one replay of Luna which was a spiral/crise spin.

Ken

 

[Ken B]

JDBerry,
I'm with you on how the rollover looks and feels. But after watching some slo mo video, then going out and taking some slo mo of myself, I found that what I thought was happening didn't. If I was to take a snapshot of the exact moment of release between my peel and rollover pitches, it would be tough to tell them apart. As much as it feels like my fingers are coming up and over the ball, they just don't.

What I've found in many pitches is that PC's tell students to do or feel the release a certain way to get the result:
-pull their fingers up the front side of the ball for a rise
-pull them over the top and down the front for a rollover,

In warmups they practice these spins in this slower and exaggerated fashion, but when they throw full speed and we watch in slo mo, it actually isn't happening. The feel gets the result and it tends to blur reality and becomes perpetuated as reality.

Don't trust me or anyone else--check it out for yourself in slo mo.


Ken