What is "Turning the Triangle"?

[Tewks]

So the aggressive rotation of the triangle is not a reasonable question?

I have told You I have tried it accept its called "tht"

Creating a tight hand pivot point by the rear shoulder is huge. The drill Your doing describing flat hands avoiding the push I have been doing for years and use it all the time. This is why I use the queue hit with the back shoulder. This helps keep the hands back while maintaining a tight hpp.

IMO the aggressive triangle drill does not allow for a tight hpp.

It was reasonable and I posted the video of Sheffield to address it. THT is "top hand torque" and is different. I love when people write off something new and call it a "rehash" even though it is entirely different from a feel standpoint. It has a different name because it is different. The feel of turning the triangle is in the hands - both hands. Many people think the feel is in the elbows or arms, but it should not be. You have admittedly tried THT. Please do the drill you call into question, film it, and post it. Help everybody else learn too!

Swinging a bat is aggressive... turning the triangle with the hands is also aggressive. There have been multiple threads on this forum about SB players not being aggressive enough. If I was working with a player to be more aggressive, I'd rather they commit and go too far than not enough. You can tone down the aggressiveness and make it more precise, but it needs to be there to start with.

 

[Cannonball]

Tweks, when you say, "turn the triangle with the hands," are you meaning "hands" or arms, wrist, and hands? I might also say that cues and drills might be different or new but the swing even back to Babe Ruth is the same. I will agree that there have been moments in time where adaptions were made but today's swing closely resembles much of what the Babe or Ted did. Do you disagree on that?

 

[TDS]

It was reasonable and I posted the video of Sheffield to address it. THT is "top hand torque" and is different. I love when people write off something new and call it a "rehash" even though it is entirely different from a feel standpoint. It has a different name because it is different. The feel of turning the triangle is in the hands - both hands. Many people think the feel is in the elbows or arms, but it should not be. You have admittedly tried THT. Please do the drill you call into question, film it, and post it. Help everybody else learn too!

Swinging a bat is aggressive... turning the triangle with the hands is also aggressive. There have been multiple threads on this forum about SB players not being aggressive enough. If I was working with a player to be more aggressive, I'd rather they commit and go too far than not enough. You can tone down the aggressiveness and make it more precise, but it needs to be there to start with.

Do You believe in a tight hand pivot point? This drill weather I use the hands as the focal point or arms promotes barrel dumping when firing the rear hip.
Have you tried this aggressive move hitting live? How was your ball striking consistency?

 

[Tewks]

Tweks, when you say, "turn the triangle with the hands," are you meaning "hands" or arms, wrist, and hands? I might also say that cues and drills might be different or new but the swing even back to Babe Ruth is the same. I will agree that there have been moments in time where adaptions were made but today's swing closely resembles much of what the Babe or Ted did. Do you disagree on that?

The forearms and wrists are involved, but the feel is in the hands. My verbal cues are for the hands to control the barrel, not the arms or wrists. When you go to the arms, the hand pivot point suffers and there is usually bat drag. When you go the wrists, the swing tends to get loopy.

 

[Tewks]

Do You believe in a tight hand pivot point? This drill weather I use the hands as the focal point or arms promotes barrel dumping when firing the rear hip.
Have you tried this aggressive move hitting live? How was your ball striking consistency?

Yes I believe in a tight hand pivot point. What do you consider barrel dumping to be? The video you posted is not a good example of the drill being done correctly. If you feel you are dumping the barrel, you are not doing it correctly.

You are holding onto this drill as some sort of an absolute. I have already stated that it is a progression. Nobody is going to do Howard's face and fire drill in the game. I have kids hit from one foot all the time, but I wouldn't have them do that in a game either.

Please post video of your attempts. Until you do that, I don't know why I should keep responding.

 

[Tewks]

TDS,

Here's the video of my player I just took. He's a sophomore, about 5'5" and 135 lbs. (His dad is 6'2"... hopefully he'll get some height!!!)

Do you consider this player to be dumping the barrel? Sprained his ankle playing basketball this week. Last night, we did simulated at bats and he did very well - hitting from one foot with a swing just like this. He didn't know he was recreating the drill when I filmed him... this is just his swing. The simulated at bats were from 30 ft and I was throwing 44-48 MPH fastballs, curves were 33-37, change ups were 34ish, and I was mixing in a slider around 38-41. The Jugs gun was out the whole night to make sure I was staying as consistent as possible with the speeds. Here's a spreadsheet to show what kind of velocity this compares to in terms of reaction time.

I should add that this player is using too much arms. We are working on getting him more into the hands and more precise. Again, he's a sophomore and his father can't believe how the ball is coming off his bat. It is always a process.


Also... when you view the video, click on the video to pause it. Then you can use the arrow keys to go frame-by-frame.

 

[MVLA Softball]

Tewks, GREAT stuff. This forum is amazing.
I can't get the frame-by-frame mode to kick in. If I click on the video, it doesn't stop. I have to click on the pause icon. but then the arrow keys have no function.

Who is the guy starting at 3/31? The techniques he uses in 4/31 do not seem completely consistent with yours, but it is good to hear knowledgeable people.
Thanks.

 

[Tewks]

Tewks, GREAT stuff. This forum is amazing.
I can't get the frame-by-frame mode to kick in. If I click on the video, it doesn't stop. I have to click on the pause icon. but then the arrow keys have no function.

Who is the guy starting at 3/31? The techniques he uses in 4/31 do not seem completely consistent with yours, but it is good to hear knowledgeable people.
Thanks.

The video may not work with certain web browsers. I use Firefox.

What guy are you talking about? What does 3/31 and 4/31 mean?

 

[TDS]

What do you consider barrel dumping to be?

Barrel dumping is when You lose control of the barrel during hip thrust. I do like the single leg hip thrust drill was doing it with students earlier in the week. The hands are the weakest link in the chain. This aggressive drill promotes disconnection where the hands swivel beyond the flat position so I don't see how this helps in the progression.

Do you consider this player to be dumping the barrel?

I am using firefox as well and can't view it frame by frame.

I am sorry if your taking this personal. I do like and use some of the drills you have shown. I don't understand the need to focus on this kind of hand action when they add very little until the whip which during that time they IMO are reacting and then directing the momentum not trying to create its own.

 

[Tewks]

Barrel dumping is when You lose control of the barrel during hip thrust. I do like the single leg hip thrust drill was doing it with students earlier in the week. The hands are the weakest link in the chain. This aggressive drill promotes disconnection where the hands swivel beyond the flat position so I don't see how this helps in the progression.



I am using firefox as well and can't view it frame by frame.

I am sorry if your taking this personal. I do like and use some of the drills you have shown. I don't understand the need to focus on this kind of hand action when they add very little until the whip which during that time they IMO are reacting and then directing the momentum not trying to create its own.

I am definitely not taking this personal. I do want you to try it though and post your results. I disagree that it promotes "disconnection." I feel it promotes the exact opposite.