Umpires: Lineup card training?

[Comp]

Yes the flex does have to be on the field or they have left the game and must use a reentry to come back in.

Your example of switching pitchers and the flex goes to the bench, the flex has left the game and must reenter to come back in.

The flex is a defensive position and MUST play defense or they have left the game. I know the dp/flex rule inside and out and I can assure you what you are claiming is not correct and is against the rules.

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[corlay]

Yes the flex does have to be on the field or they have left the game and must use a reentry to come back in.

100% true.
FLEX *HAS* to play the field every inning she is in the lineup. (or else she is out, and DP/FLEX collapses to the DP becoming a regular player of 9 in the lineup...) YOU can take a bench player and Sub her into the FLEX position if you want,
but you can never "switch" the DP and FLEX - meaning FLEX can never bat for the DP and the DP can never play the field for the FLEX, unless you collapse the DP/FLEX into a single player.

You can collapse the DP/Flex down to a single position at any point in the game,
with either the DP OR the FLEX player moving to the bench. And then can later re-expand the lineup to DP/FLEX by re-entering the removed player. (or even a new bench player, not yet in the lineup). You don't see the collapse and especially the re-expand of DP/FLEX that often - but it is useful in certain situations.

Also note: if DP/FLEX is not utilized on the lineup card to start the game, you may NOT introduce a DP/FLEX scenario during that game.

 

[CHSUmp97]

The flex does not have to be on the field. You can even make this change at the plate conference. You know, when the umpire asks if there are any changes before he/she makes it official.

Example: Flex is listed in the tenth spot and is currently the pitcher. After the first pitch, the DP can be inserted into the defensive position at first base, first base can move to the pitcher position, flex comes to the bench. No charged substitutions.

No, this is a substitution. When the DP plays defense for the Flex, the Flex did officially leave the lineup, so now you're down to 9 players playing. When you reenter the Flex on defense, she has exhausted her one allowed reentry, and you revert back to a 10-player lineup.

Example: Flex is the current pitcher of record. DP warms up and comes in to relief. Flex is now on the bench. No charged substitutions.

Again, same as above. This is an official substitution, reducing the lineup from 10 to 9. When the Flex reenters, she's used up her one reentry. If the DP plays defense for that Flex one more time, then that player can no longer reenter the game. But you can enter a new player as Flex as long as she's a bench player that hasn't entered the game previously as a substitute.

Example: Flex is the current pitcher of record. Umpire is squeezing her hard. Coach calls time and brings DP into throw. Flex goes to the bench. First base makes three errors, Coach asks for time again and put Flex at first base. No charged substitutions.

Like before, when the DP came in to pitch and the Flex went to the bench, this is a substitution. When the Flex reenters at first base, she has exhausted her one reentry. The player who was playing first base is still in the batting order for offense only.

This is the great thing about the DP/Flex rule. It is a free body to enter any defensive position without it being charged a substitution. It is unfortunately, the most misunderstood rule as well.

The only time there is no substitution is when the DP and Flex remain in the game. So if the DP comes in to play defense for any other player other than the Flex, there was no substitution because you still have a 10-player lineup. The only difference is that the player who went to the bench when the DP took over her defensive position is playing offense only. But once you go from 10 to 9 in the lineup, that requires a substitution.

The same is true when the Flex bats for the DP. That removes the DP from the lineup, going from 10 to 9. To go back to 10, the DP reenters into the batting order for the Flex, and exhausts her one reentry for the game. If the Flex bats for her again, that player is done for the day and cannot reenter as the DP. But another sub can enter as DP.

 

[CoachYodaD]

Thank you.

I have been getting away with some crazy substitutions. Actually, it is probably moving from 10 to 9 and back again one time. I really don't do much substituting in a game. I do, almost religiously though, have a DP/Flex for the versatility of that extra defensive player.

 

[corlay]

I have been getting away with some crazy substitutions.

it can be really hard to track, especially if the rules are "bent" with players on defense, but not on offense.

Example: We had a HS team in our conference this year that was strongly accused of playing 2 FLEX players on defense simultaneously,
and neither batted. One was a legit FLEX, and the other an unannounced "defensive substitution" - which occurred every defensive inning.
(and the "illegal player" played in RF...)
Basically running TWO DP/FLEX.
This team had 2 large, powerful hitters, that weren't necessarily agile enough to play the field on defense well. So, neither took the field on defense (one was the legit DP).

The batting order followed the lineup card submitted at the start of the game, without any illegal deviation.

unless you have a VERY alert bookkeeper or coaching staff,
this is very hard to catch.

 

[mmeece]

Thank you.

I have been getting away with some crazy substitutions. Actually, it is probably moving from 10 to 9 and back again one time. I really don't do much substituting in a game. I do, almost religiously though, have a DP/Flex for the versatility of that extra defensive player.

I certainly don't encourage breaking the rules but it's pretty easy to get away with when it doesn't change the batting order. We caught one similar to what @corlay wrote about but only because the hitter who never took the field was HUGE. Hard to miss a girl 6'3 or bigger not playing the field lol.

 

[Comp]

Just be warned, under USA rules if the unreported sub makes a play on defense the offended coach can bring it to the umpires attention and gets the result of the play or a do over plus whatever penalties may be involved with the unreported sub.

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[The Man In Blue]

Not yet mentioned, but another common misbelief: I have had coaches swear they can exchange the DP/flex while running bases like courtesy runners.

No.

 

[marriard]

Not yet mentioned, but another common misbelief: I have had coaches swear they can exchange the DP/flex while running bases like courtesy runners.

No.

NSA has (had?)a 'twinning' rule rather a DP/FLEX which allows this. I haven't done NSA in 4 or 5 years so not sure if they still have it. Basically it is 2 players in one spot in the lineup and you could exchange them however you wanted how many times you wanted.

 

[The Man In Blue]

Never worked NSA ... interesting ... now I know where they got it from!