Thoughts on what Gwynn is suggesting.

[Work=wins]

The hips get/stay out of the way on their own if the posterior chain is engaged. It’s that simple.

what TG is teaching is disassociation. It should be reactive. Sequence/stability should get you there. If not you could train it. To me the stretch from the middle to the upper during the forward move is the power stretch( I never see the middle stray to far from its starting point). Not the hips opening to a closed shoulder structure. I guess it’s more mobility based imo.

 

[clemenslee1]

The hips get/stay out of the way on their own if the posterior chain is engaged. It’s that simple.

what TG is teaching is disassociation. It should be reactive. Sequence/stability should get you there. If not you could train it. To me the stretch from the middle to the upper during the forward move is the power stretch( I never see the middle stray to far from its starting point). Not the hips opening to a closed shoulder structure. I guess it’s more mobility based imo.

View attachment 23667

View attachment 23668

How do you communicate that to a young player?

 

[Work=wins]

How do you communicate that to a young player?

It’s about maintaining angles and balance. i train posture and core stability. I train the posterior chain to be engaged early. For a young kid it’s about smaller slower movements. So they can feel the body move and get an idea of what a good sequence feels like.

engaging the posterior chain is where it’s at to stabilize the structure.. engage the heels by pushing the hips back and balancing that w the chest getting over the plate. Then time that to a moving ball. Maintain those angles w core stability. Sounds hard, but it’s not. It’s subtle. Don’t over bake.

 

[Mudders Brudder]

If you a 7 or 8 year old to throw their hands to start the swing they will generally have a very armsy swing without much torso helping.

Agreed, all of the hitters in the below collage....

....have lagging hips as they all initiate their swings with their upper half (shoulders/arms), instead of their lower half (hips/torso).

That's why the cue "hit the ball with your rear hip" helps many developing hitters get the swing started from the correct body part(s).

Some might want to replace "rear hip" with "torso" to meet their beliefs, but I've found over the years that kids are more able to understand specific body parts vs a more general or generic term that's comprised of many. JMO, OMMV.

EDIT: This all falls in the category of the older "bottom up" vs "top down" swing terms. The young hitters in the image are all "top down", and all MLB and advanced hitters are "bottom up". The determination of where the "bottom" starts is still up for debate; some say the "ground up", while others will say the "hips/torso up". But regardless of where your "bottom" is, it must always initiate the swing before the "top" does.

 

[clemenslee1]

Agreed, all of the hitters in the below collage....

....have lagging hips as they all initiate their swings with their upper half (shoulders/arms), instead of their lower half (hips/torso).

That's why the cue "hit the ball with your rear hip" helps many developing hitters get the swing started from the correct body part(s).

Some might want to replace "rear hip" with "torso" to meet their beliefs, but I've found over the years that kids are more able to understand specific body parts vs a more general or generic term that's comprised of many. JMO, OMMV.

EDIT: This all falls in the category of the older "bottom up" vs "top down" swing terms. The young hitters in the image are all "top down", and all MLB and advanced hitters are "bottom up". The determination of where the "bottom" starts is still up for debate; some say the "ground up", while others will say the "hips/torso up". But regardless of where your "bottom" is, it must always initiate the swing before the "top" does.

So, if presented with these issues you would look to the lower half first?

 

[Work=wins]

Agreed, all of the hitters in the below collage....

....have lagging hips as they all initiate their swings with their upper half (shoulders/arms), instead of their lower half (hips/torso).

That's why the cue "hit the ball with your rear hip" helps many developing hitters get the swing started from the correct body part(s).

Some might want to replace "rear hip" with "torso" to meet their beliefs, but I've found over the years that kids are more able to understand specific body parts vs a more general or generic term that's comprised of many. JMO, OMMV.

EDIT: This all falls in the category of the older "bottom up" vs "top down" swing terms. The young hitters in the image are all "top down", and all MLB and advanced hitters are "bottom up". The determination of where the "bottom" starts is still up for debate; some say the "ground up", while others will say the "hips/torso up". But regardless of where your "bottom" is, it must always initiate the swing before the "top" does.

you forgot ‘middle out’ Top down can be a good feel IMO. Bottom up is very slow. Maybe this vid can shed some light on why using your hips primarily without the glutes dominating its actions is detrimental to any kind of rotational athletic endeavor.

 

[Rolling Hard]

great video

 

[Mudders Brudder]

So, if presented with these issues you would look to the lower half first?

While each player is different in their pattern and sequence, so that's what address working on first. But in a general sense if we're talking about those players' swings in the image above, then yes, I'd see why their lower halves are lagging, and basically not used to swing the bat, and go from there. This is oftentimes a lower half to upper half loading sequence problem (they usually just turn their shoulders, and forget the lower half's necessary involvement), that's typically the starting point.

 

[Mudders Brudder]

you forgot ‘middle out’ Top down can be a good feel IMO. Bottom up is very slow.

That sounds as if you're not a fan or proponent of the overlap of the two halves.

Even TDS' chair drill helps teach activation of the lower half ahead of the upper half...

Maybe this vid can shed some light on why using your hips primarily without the glutes...

Wallenbrock - 1:59 mark: "We want the swing to be pelvic driven."

Did I miss the memo where the "hips" are no longer part of the "pelvis"?

 

[Mudders Brudder]

great video

Certainly is...exactly what I was (attempting to) explaining above.