The Load

[BillyB]

You said the sawing starts from the ground up. That’s function. I just showed you that his hands are initiating the swing against the ground. That’s hands down not ground up. Anything in regards to ‘ground up’ is false. Even generally speaking.

I don't agree with how you are explaning a hitters video. The hands seperate and do not fire properly, until the shoulders initiate that came from torso rotation, that came from hip rotation that were all initiated from the heal slam. "yes there is more in there, but now we are just boring everybody" Just my opinion.

PS.
Ground up is not literal. Proper sequencing legit works in steps.

 

[Work=wins]

I don't agree with how you are explaning a hitters video. The hands seperate and do not fire properly, until the shoulders initiate that came from torso rotation, that came from hip rotation that were all initiated from the heal slam. "yes there is more in there, but now we are just boring everybody" Just my opinion.

PS.
Ground up is not literal. Proper sequencing legit works in steps.

Yes I know. 1234 isn’t what you think it is. It just measures rotational speeds. It doesn’t tell you why the rotation HAPPENS. All I can say is the kinetics are king in regards to learning how to produce the swings we see. Kinematics are fluff.

The 1234 info is kinematics. Not function or cause. To produce the 1234 you gotta get opposites going; hips forward while hands go back. Sequential loading. But launch isn’t 1234. They still can’t measure that. They dont have the proper hand sensors to see what the hands are actually doing. Another year or so maybe.

 

[Work=wins]

Don’t worry @BillyB all these posts pertain to ‘loading’ so we’re good.

 

[BillyB]

Yes I know. 1234 isn’t what you think it is. It just measures rotational speeds. It doesn’t tell you why the rotation HAPPENS. All I can say is the kinetics are king in regards to learning how to produce the swings we see. Kinematics are fluff.

The 1234 info is kinematics. Not function or cause. To produce the 1234 you gotta get opposites going; hips forward while hands go back. Sequential loading. But launch isn’t 1234. They still can’t measure that. They dont have the proper hand sensors to see what the hands are actually doing. Another year or so maybe.

Believe me, we are 100% on the same page with regards to seperating and the upper half moving back, while the front leg goes forward, while weight loading the rear hip. The key is in my opinion, IF you don't have the lower half working correctly, you are dead in the water and will have major inconsistencies. ANY hitter that is having issues, put them in the box and front toss, or tee work. Have them step to toe, slam heel and stop. Stay there, then finish the swing for the next bucket doing that...9 times out of 10 the ball will be much more cleanly hit, than if they went through their normal swing progression, IF they are having issues. You have to correct any lower half issues "IF that is part of a problem you are seeing", before you can tweak and or progress to the upper half as the lower begins the process.

I'm not here for petty posts or any conversation surrounding things like my way is the only way type stuff, just working to make better hitters. We apply all different techniques to help each individual become better. There are WAYYYYYY to many quality techniques/methods out there, to just die on a one way hill. I know without even asking, we use a lot of what you work through in training.

 

[Shawn]

@Work=wins, @Shawn and others GITT
Gonna ramble a bit. I’m sure there are plenty of threads on this but didn’t want to read through them all.

Loading properly and on time sets the ground work for a hitter having the time to get to a powerful launch position. If load is off the hitter will make compensations in an effort to get the barrel to the ball (rushed swing).

yes we want to get a full load.

How do we develop and train a hitters ability to put a powerful swing on every pitch? Being late can never be an issue to accomplish this.

Yeah. I was trying to load early, start sooner off the pitching machine. I was getting smoked. Behind and rushed, Afterwards I was like duh, I was just getting the front leg up early. I didn’t load and stretch properly at all. Not at max stretch or anything close,

The technique gives you the best chance to take your A swing. Hitting the ball consistently well is the goal. Is every one a HR grade A?, because it’s not how far you hit it, it’s how often you hit it far.

Technique gives you quickness, you launch n direct. To take your A swing you can’t try to direct then swing.

Went back and watch some video. Work mentioned the relationship between the front heel and the hands. I noticed nearly every high level hitter I watched almost simultaneously pick the front foot up and hands worked back (stretch).

Yes but the stretch is happening off the handle of the slingshot, back leg upper back.

The two actions happening together., lower and upper.

Keep watching and studying the swing. When I started 25 years ago I came many of great conclusions. Then I started listening to Gurus. What you’re seeing is what I called the change in the direction of the knob. I was studying the stretch in the swing. I also said that initial hip rotation created more stretch. Now I know it’s the back leg.

Got me to thinking, what are the mechanics of a good load? One commonality between all types of high level hitters is the front heel and the hands. Knee lifts vary. Some knee lift back toward belly button, some knee lift high and not back, some knee lift low. Some knee lift and don’t move forward, some knee lift and float forward, some knee lift and move rearwards and stay back.

I know some will say the load is “style”. But if we can agree that the load sets the foundation for a hitter being able to put a powerful swing on every pitch then I think it’s important that dads and hitting instructors understand it and train it.

I do very specific actions to coil and stretch. You have to create tensions/resistance, a complete body Tonus. Like the tiger , stalking its prey. it’s entire muscular system activated.

One leg. You have be one legged.

I’ll read the thread before commenting.

 

[Work=wins]

To me this is the ^^^ right way to go about things. All due to ROM and timing of these things. So things are ‘straight’ or inline at contact like this:




The hands have control of the bat and have the longest to travel so they start to get ‘down and back’ first. Then the torso counters and then the hips coil a bit which puts some weight back. Thereafter some weight is released forward via the stride but caused by the upper half load. Akin to walking or the ‘leap of faith’. Counter rotation is how we walk.

Going this deep is getting into the weeds but to me ensures that certain flaws really never really appear like early extension or dumping/casting. It’s all timed based and ROM based off a really fast moving ball. So I guess nothing is full-proof. This is what I mean by loading late. Basically while the toe is touching down and the hands are preparing to throw the head. I dont want the ‘load’ to be before the pitch is released. It doesn’t make sense to me. Not w how the body is designed to deliver the bat imo.

Edit: and to me the launch sequence is exactly the same. Hands, core then hips. Rotation isnt launch its transition. Extension is launch to me.

 

[Shawn]

I don't agree with how you are explaning a hitters video. The hands seperate and do not fire properly, until the shoulders initiate that came from torso rotation, that came from hip rotation that were all initiated from the heal slam. "yes there is more in there, but now we are just boring everybody" Just my opinion.

PS.
Ground up is not literal. Proper sequencing legit works in steps.

I think what he is saying is your opinion sucks. lol

Seriously though another thing I saw in hitters from actually studying hitters for myself and swinging 25 years ago. I came to the conclusion that swinging from the ground up was too slow and disconnected. I came to the conclusion that the hands fired first and now I know how.

 

[Shawn]

Cornbread

If the hands and stride (no details) continues in opposite directions) the swing will just happen.

Definitely don’t worry about foot plant. The back leg sets the foot down. That’s kinda why you lift it, with a little knee lift. If you’re watching your stretch between the hands and stride, pay attention to how the front foot just stop going forward. Almost like it hits an invisible wall. It’s the stretch, launch position.

 

[Shawn]

The back leg and upperbody are at max stretch. But, we have to see the before this to see before and after. The connection of the back leg pulling on the upper is tight. The hands being the other pivot point. The two rotational points fire at the same time. The hands and back hip being in different positions so the leg is pulling at the time you swing rearward.

It’s “one thing” , the swing happens at tilt.

When your still pulling back on off speed it’s over.

 

[Rolling Hard]

starts from the ground up... your hands don't start the bat movement. Sequencing drills can really tighten things up from a muscle memory point, but it has to be done repeatedly like any other thing you work on.

The middle/core/obliques/and a lot of other muscles load AND unload the bottom (hips) and top (shoulder chasis) in a sequence that produces whip and uncoilling. So the core uses the ground, if that makes sense.
I don't get W=W hands thing unless he is speaking of loose wrist hinge.
W=W check out Malaska golf instruction. He basically says you throw your hands and the body will respond/sync up. I think it can work but I don't like it. I am much more hand are slave to the core and for fine adjustment.