So tired of hearing "it's not fair" from other parents

[BobInMadison]

OK, there is a right way and a wrong way to deal with public prayer. (PRIVATE prayer is a completely different matter). All the comments you made are correct.

In the case you mentioned, people with differing religious views were respected. In the case I mentioned, people with differing religious views were NOT respected. I spent a number of years in my youth in a part of the country where differing religious views were often not respected, unfortunately. My particular religious views were not in the mainstream in that area. When people respected my views, I respected theirs. When I was invited to prayer groups or bible study or vacation bible school, I went with my friends. I didn't have much use for the people who showed no respect for my set of beliefs. I was very touched, many years later, when teaching not far from where I grew up, when people with the beliefs more common in that area actually apologized to me for the less tolerant people. My new friends felt intolerance made their religion look bad. As for my new friends: I would join them in their church activities, or prayer meetings, or whatever when invited. That is just my style.

The incident I described earlier wasn't someone freaking out over a few words of prayer. My friend was a tough guy, who later killed several people in hand-to-hand combat. The problem was the humiliation poured onto him and his sister in their youth by intolerant teachers, who were armed with the power of the state to lead prayers.

As for what the coach should do? Any wise coach will make sure not one single player on the team feels excluded by a team activity.

You mentioned one way to handle it. Around Madison, WI, they usually handle it by leaving public prayer out of things altogether. It is interesting to me to see how reticent many people in Madison are about discussing religion. In other places, people were often very open about religion, and some wore it on their sleeves, so to speak. I was astounded that the father of two girls who are close friends of two of my daughters is a minister, and my daughters don't even know what denomination. They consider it impolite to ask.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

OK, there is a right way and a wrong way to deal with public prayer. (PRIVATE prayer is a completely different matter). All the comments you made are correct.

In the case you mentioned, people with differing religious views were respected. In the case I mentioned, people with differing religious views were NOT respected. I spent a number of years in my youth in a part of the country where differing religious views were often not respected, unfortunately. My particular religious views were not in the mainstream in that area. When people respected my views, I respected theirs. When I was invited to prayer groups or bible study or vacation bible school, I went with my friends. I didn't have much use for the people who showed no respect for my set of beliefs. I was very touched, many years later, when teaching not far from where I grew up, when people with the beliefs more common in that area actually apologized to me for the less tolerant people. My new friends felt intolerance made their religion look bad. As for my new friends: I would join them in their church activities, or prayer meetings, or whatever when invited. That is just my style.

The incident I described earlier wasn't someone freaking out over a few words of prayer. My friend was a tough guy, who later killed several people in hand-to-hand combat. The problem was the humiliation poured onto him and his sister in their youth by intolerant teachers, who were armed with the power of the state to lead prayers.

As for what the coach should do? Any wise coach will make sure not one single player on the team feels excluded by a team activity.

You mentioned one way to handle it. Around Madison, WI, they usually handle it by leaving public prayer out of things altogether. It is interesting to me to see how reticent many people in Madison are about discussing religion. In other places, people were often very open about religion, and some wore it on their sleeves, so to speak. I was astounded that the father of two girls who are close friends of two of my daughters is a minister, and my daughters don't even know what denomination. They consider it impolite to ask.

Very respectable post my friend. There are extremists in every group, that includes softball. You just have to take them with a grain of salt. What our society needs, and has lost, is compassion and understanding of others. As an example, my wife is a liberal, where I'm a conservative. Her religion is Seventh Day Aventists, mine is Church of Christ, very BIG difference in views. We've been married 19 years and are the best of friends.........despite her being wrong about everything.

 

[BobInMadison]

Well, my wife and I are different political parties, different religions, different races, different national origin, etc.

The only difference is that *I* am the one who is wrong about everything.

I don't completely agree that this society has lost compassion and understanding of others. There is a rather noisy fringe group of extremists, as you mentioned, that seem to get way too much attention. Add to that the people who make their living writing articles about the lunatics on the other side prove that the other side is evil.

Or, I remember graduate school in NY. At one point there was an Iranian Jew and an Egyptian Muslim with desks next to each other in my research group. We never had meetings on Friday afternoons, so the Jew could get home in time for the Sabbath. During Ramadan, we scheduled our meetings earlier so the Muslim could get home in time for the post-fast dinner. The Iranian Jew had several friends who were always visiting: his roommate, an Iranian Muslim; a mutual friend, an Iranian Bahai; his former girlfriend, an Italian-American Roman Catholic. All were close friends, and all respected each others' different faiths. At one point my mother came to visit, and the Egyptian Muslim and her mother made some baklava for my mother and me to eat. She even encouraged us to eat in her presence, even though she was fasting for Ramadan at the time.

I think the level of tolerance in this society is, if anything, growing, despite the noise on the internet. I grew up in the South, and there is FAR more respect for people of other races than in the past, and the change was rather fast.

 

[nanotech14]

Please close this thread.

 

[BrianMonk]

The only difference is that *I* am the one who is wrong about everything.

At least your wife has you trained well

 

[JJsqueeze]

So anyhoo....it does kind of suck when parents complain a lot...my take away form the thread is they should stop their complaining and silently pray for more playing time for their DD, and after that contribute to a new scoreboard or some uniforms.

 

[Indiana]

^^^^ I agree

I like the comment about taking Football out of the equation for Title IX numbers. Football is the massive revenue sport and deserves to be in a class by itself. Maybe with all of the lawsuits going on now, schools will try to figure out a way to be fair to the football players (and basketball) regarding the school's and NCAA's use of the boys images, profiting from jersey sales, etc. while not breaking the bank paying the non-revenue athletes.

Maybe this whole thing will just barely work itself out in the end.

I think parents need to be a bit more patient about the process. Parents tend to react emotionally to their kids' situations instead of stepping back and looking at the big picture over time. I need to remind myself of this every day!

 

[chinamigarden]

^^^^ I agree

I like the comment about taking Football out of the equation for Title IX numbers. Football is the massive revenue sport and deserves to be in a class by itself. Maybe with all of the lawsuits going on now, schools will try to figure out a way to be fair to the football players (and basketball) regarding the school's and NCAA's use of the boys images, profiting from jersey sales, etc. while not breaking the bank paying the non-revenue athletes.

Maybe this whole thing will just barely work itself out in the end.

I think parents need to be a bit more patient about the process. Parents tend to react emotionally to their kids' situations instead of stepping back and looking at the big picture over time. I need to remind myself of this every day!

Since I assume this whole thread was about HS sports and my dd goes to a "football" school. Been to the State Championship 3 times in the past 7 years and won it twice. Something like a 23 year run in the playofffs... The idea that football players need things to be made fair for them is funny. The boys in our school who play football are treated like kings, by the school and the community. If you are a boy and don't play football you are not treated well at all. God forbid you play soccer. The girls benefit by the football program in that there is a freshman volleyball team. Only because there is a freshman football team.

 

[thatcrazymom]

Wow! I never intended for the thread to go this direction. However, things have gotten better. The starters have now dropped 2 games (by one run each game), and the parents are all settling in better together. Maybe (probably) I'm overly sensitive.

 

[Softball scholar]

^^^^ I agree

I like the comment about taking Football out of the equation for Title IX numbers. Football is the massive revenue sport and deserves to be in a class by itself. Maybe with all of the lawsuits going on now, schools will try to figure out a way to be fair to the football players (and basketball) regarding the school's and NCAA's use of the boys images, profiting from jersey sales, etc. while not breaking the bank paying the non-revenue athletes.

Maybe this whole thing will just barely work itself out in the end.

I think parents need to be a bit more patient about the process. Parents tend to react emotionally to their kids' situations instead of stepping back and looking at the big picture over time. I need to remind myself of this every day!

This whole paying the players idea has some bad ramifications from it if ever happens. There are some football players who the NCAA is making money from their likeness, and thats not right either. But the reality of the situation, at least at most D1 schools is the football team revenues are playing for all those other non-revenue sports albeit men's or womens. If players are going to get paid, then this creates a big line item expense in the athletic dept budget. Theres a lot of fat in the depts, but the easy solution for athletic departments will be to cut non-revenue programs. I think the interesting question under Title IX would be do you pay the Women the same you pay the men, and do you pay the non-revenue sports the same as the revenue sports? I think Title IX would require you have to have the same pay for women. If that happens say goodby to a majority of non-revenue teams like wrestling, swimming, track, baseball, tennis.