- Sep 3, 2015
- 372
- 63
DD throws her rise with thumb off grip, PC says thumb can interfere with spin for some. She is still learning it but prefers the grip that way
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Riseball question
- Thread starter Man10
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DD was using a man's grip to throw her riseball...this gave her the best spin....Sadly she was told by local guy that is not how you hold the ball for riseball.
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Jake was told by several "experts" that she would never pitch at a high level by throwing a riseball. Throughout your DD's journey she will receive many such unsolicited pearls of wisdom from morons.
When possible I teach the thumb off grip because it forces a pull which results in a higher spin rate.
- Nov 29, 2009
- 2,975
- 83
Jake was told by several "experts" that she would never pitch at a high level by throwing a riseball. Throughout your DD's journey she will receive many such unsolicited pearls of wisdom from morons.
I have found the "Experts" who spew out that nonsense were never able to throw it themselves, so no one else can. They don't know how to teach it.
The same goes for what I call a "Power pitcher." who can throw the ball 60+. Those who were never able to do it tend to teach what they know and they do not know how to unlock all of a pitcher's potential.
Great video. Can really see her palm position change.
My 14 yo just started with the rise. Self-spins are good, but gets bullet in throws. Will have her try to get the palm up.
Start at whatever distance it takes to get perfect spin. Work for a feel of the ball rolling off the side of the index finger through release (or over the side of the thumb.). Increase effort and distance as long as she can maintain good spin. With commitment, work back into walk throughs from just behind the pitching rubber.
- Aug 21, 2008
- 2,386
- 113
For me personally, I can't imagine NOT using my thumb on a rise. Now let me clearly say, I do not know either of the ladies pictured above, have never worked with them, never seen them throw live, and never caught for them so I cannot tell you how true, correct, or how much spin they're getting on the ball. But for me, the thumb is the strongest of the fingers and absolutely necessary for me to get maximum spin. It is also a cue for me to ensure my spin is going backward, not bullet spin. As RHP, if I keep the tip of my thumb pointed to 3rd, I'm more inclined to get backspin (if I do other things correctly). Bullet spin is caused the moment the thumb turns toward the catcher, which also turns the wrist. This is why I never liked the football drills for riseballs or the expression "turning the door knob". Both will have someone turn their wrist creating bullet spin.
Again, having never seen these ladies first hand, I'm going to speak in very broad and general terms: the more hand you have on the ball, the slower it will go. The ball takes longer to get out of the hand when it's sucked back in the palm than if it was on the finger tips only. More friction is created making the pitch slower. I'm not necessarily talking about the difference between 60mph and 70mph. But, there is a difference. This is why a good majority of change ups require pitchers to engulf the ball in their entire hand. A pitcher can change speeds on ANY pitch they throw by how much hand and how many fingers they put on the ball or take off the ball. Again, not a 10mph difference but enough that may be the difference between a ground ball to 3rd and one timed perfectly through the hole at short.
All of this being said, don't let anyone ever tell you there's only one way to grip any pitch, including the rise. But, some grips have more advantages than others (i.e. amount of hand on the ball, being able to pick it early, etc.) but that doesn't make them "incorrect". The spin is the absolute, not necessarily the grip.
Bill
Again, having never seen these ladies first hand, I'm going to speak in very broad and general terms: the more hand you have on the ball, the slower it will go. The ball takes longer to get out of the hand when it's sucked back in the palm than if it was on the finger tips only. More friction is created making the pitch slower. I'm not necessarily talking about the difference between 60mph and 70mph. But, there is a difference. This is why a good majority of change ups require pitchers to engulf the ball in their entire hand. A pitcher can change speeds on ANY pitch they throw by how much hand and how many fingers they put on the ball or take off the ball. Again, not a 10mph difference but enough that may be the difference between a ground ball to 3rd and one timed perfectly through the hole at short.
All of this being said, don't let anyone ever tell you there's only one way to grip any pitch, including the rise. But, some grips have more advantages than others (i.e. amount of hand on the ball, being able to pick it early, etc.) but that doesn't make them "incorrect". The spin is the absolute, not necessarily the grip.
Bill
So, do you think the palm up in the last quarter helps with the rise ball spin for some?
It seems my daughter just can't do anything but bullet spin with her palm facing 3rd into release.
Thanks.
