Not all California Girls

[Screwball]

I did not know where to post this for sure, because it is about preparing young girls for softball careers. As discussed on the All-Star California thread, it does appear that NOT all parts of the country have boot-camp length practices for 6-8 year olds, 2-3x times a week, with individual coaches (2 for each player) on the side for private lessons. I can only think this is happening to prepare the players for college. (When do the parents have time to work to pay for this softball stuff I asked?)

I can't say that this is not happening elsewhere, but it seems that it shocked many posters.

Here is a link, for example, to the Alabama softball team:

ALABAMA CRIMSON TIDE - University of Alabama Official Athletic Site - Softball

(And our thoughts to students, team members and the community who have been devastated by tornadoes.)

The California dominance is waning, so the proof is in the pudding not to be offensive to anyone, just that the other areas are producing top-notch players. Thoughts?

 

[FPMark]

Good question, and I hope you get lots of responses. I think it's kind of like running in a marathon. If you start out running as hard as you can, you will burn out before the finnish line.

The superstars at 6-8 yr may really enjoy just that, being a superstar, so they play as much as possible. Boot camp type practices, tournaments, traveling, and missing out on other social activities don't matter. But by 12-14 some of the non superstars start to catch up, without missing out on other activities at the earlier ages. The mental part of the game plays a more important role than the physical part, so while the later developing player is begining to be more focused, the younger superstars mind may be getting more distracted. By HS the desire to practice may be replaced by desires to socialize, and since they have been trained in an "all or nothing" type environment, they could lose their love for the game and not be able to stay focused.

I'm not saying that this 'will' happen, but in coaching my DD's team I have noticed that most of the superstars from 6-8 are no longer playing by HS, while the girls who had a more balanced level of different activities, and have gradually migrated more and more toward SB, are the superstars today. Just my thoughts based on observations, and I too am curious what others think.

 

[Kevin Merryman]

I have read the thread that Screwball is discussing and I have also experienced some of the things he is talking about. We have a pro that comes in and runs a clinic for us. She was on the Italian National team and played pro ball for Italia. When we lost players to a team that runs a 126 game season and holds three practices a week, we asked her what she thought about the whole thing, we didn't mention that it wasn't us thinking of doing it, we just asked about the long season and practices. She was very upset with that line of thinking. She said and I quote "kids need time to learn the game and playing that much will make them resent a game that they should love the play. They need time to do other things as well. "
With that said, she learned to pitch when she was 12. Her pitching speed is 67 mph today and in HS she was at 70mph. She also has a friend that decided to start playing at 16 and is now a pro ball player on the national team. So basically the moral of the story is this, it doesn't matter when you start or how much you play, it's how much you love the sport and want to be there. And if they want to play, they will do their best to be a top notch player. Whether you have a dome in cold weather states or are lucky enough to be a warm weather state, or you have none of that, it doesn't matter, the stars will always come through. This is only my opinion though.

So I agree, the amount of time practicing and playing doesn't make the player, the desire makes the player. And if you burn out a good one, then you have no one to blame but yourself as a parent.

There are always exceptions for everything and if the kids have the desire then go for it!! But there needs to be a happy medium for the rest or you will run them off. I have seen it time and time again.

I am not slamming the ones that are doing it, but parents (and coaches as well) need to understand that not everyone is cut out to play all year around, even some top notch players. So they all need to choose wisely their teams when they make decisions based on that. Myself, we run a 40 -50 game schedule (about 9 tourney's) The girls love it, and they have time to do their other things as well. I do have practices in the winter, but I also understand when a player has a basketball or volleyball game. So I try and run the practices on the weekend to avoid that.
I can also say that we do have a "Drill Sargent" type organization about 20 miles away from us and the person that runs it got his daughter to the point that a D1 school offered her a scholarship only to have her turn it down and retire her cleats because she was burnt out.

 

[starsnuffer]

I think the intense softball at 6yo in California is not the cause of the softball phenoms that come out of California, but the effect of said phenoms.

I see this over and over again in all things children related. It seems especially heavy in the Asian influenced communities in California in music and academics, and sports related in Latino communities. For whatever reason, a lot of people believe that starting something earlier in life produces stronger results later on. . . . even after this myth has been debunked time after time. I can only believe that this is a social-culture trend as it has absolutely nothing to do with college level sports, art, or academics.

Even if the 6 year olds do not burn out, love the game, and continue to play when they are 18, there is no data that suggests that an 18 year old with 12 years of all star background is more able to compete with 18 year olds who do not have such a background.

I think that many parents and cultures use "throwing money at their children" as a way to fill the void left behind by absentee parenting, but there is no data to prove that. I can only hope that the coaches of the world are better parents then the ones throwing money but not actively involved, because it is these coaches that are raising these children, not the biological parents.

-W

 

[Kevin Merryman]

I think that many parents and cultures use "throwing money at their children" as a way to fill the void left behind by absentee parenting, but there is no data to prove that. I can only hope that the coaches of the world are better parents then the ones throwing money but not actively involved, because it is these coaches that are raising these children, not the biological parents.
-W

I have seen this many times. That is why I have always said and practiced that a coach may have more influence of a child's life than their parents because we have NO idea what goes on at home for this kids. And as a coach we need promote a positive environment for them.

 

[SoftSocDad]

Good question, and I hope you get lots of responses. I think it's kind of like running in a marathon. If you start out running as hard as you can, you will burn out before the finnish line.

The superstars at 6-8 yr may really enjoy just that, being a superstar, so they play as much as possible. Boot camp type practices, tournaments, traveling, and missing out on other social activities don't matter. But by 12-14 some of the non superstars start to catch up, without missing out on other activities at the earlier ages. The mental part of the game plays a more important role than the physical part, so while the later developing player is begining to be more focused, the younger superstars mind may be getting more distracted. By HS the desire to practice may be replaced by desires to socialize, and since they have been trained in an "all or nothing" type environment, they could lose their love for the game and not be able to stay focused.

I'm not saying that this 'will' happen, but in coaching my DD's team I have noticed that most of the superstars from 6-8 are no longer playing by HS, while the girls who had a more balanced level of different activities, and have gradually migrated more and more toward SB, are the superstars today. Just my thoughts based on observations, and I too am curious what others think.

Excellent post.

Screwball - California's dominance is waning simply because other areas care more about fastpitch now than they did in decades past. There are still school districts in the South playing slow-pitch in HS. Other areas have always had great athletes, but only in recent years are more of them migrating to softball. Whereas generations of California girls have played fastpitch for decades, many other parts of the country are only on their 2nd generation, where the moms and dads are encouraging their daughters to take up fastpitch softball in places that have been largely dominated by baseball and other sports.

 

[SoCalSoftballdad]

I find it hilarious that you equate CA fastpitch with "boot-camp" and drill sargents! IME, I see the opposite. I see parents volunteering their time to help kids (most not related to them) learn teamwork, softball fundamentals, sportmanship, and the value of working towards a goal and accomplishing it. Most importantly what I see at the ball fields is big smiles, cheering, laughter, and families together to participate in a GAME. Don't try to make it out to be something other than what it is.

 

[SD DAD]

I'll come in here and contribute since it was my original post that started all this madness.....sorry about that btw....

Here's my history with the sport to give you an idea....I've coached for about 8 years. Little sis played growing up, from rec to travel. Wife and all her current friends played travel from the age of 10. All grew up together and most of them played college ball. Been with wife since we were both 14. With that said, my dd has been around softball since she was born. my 14 month old....same thing. What do you think these kids are going to want to do growing up? They are going to want to play! Now there are parents that will stick to one thing and that's it but for the most part, there is a large population of hispanics in socal, most of them did not grow up playing softball. Me for example, my dd tried soccer and basketball (yes, i pushed her into that one). She didn't like either one. ended up with softball and that's what she stuck with. and LOVES it. That's all she wants to do! That and play the freaking guitar which forced me to have to learn.

What i'm getting at is that the kids around here do not have to get pushed into softball, the kids that are good, for the most part have older sisters playing travel ball and grew up at parks. Now if the kids love it that much, what's wrong with getting them some help to try to help them with something they love! Would we have this same discussion if my dd for example, was playing guitar 4 hours a day (she only does 45 min. daily) and we got her guitar lessons because she begged us for them? Doesn't seem like it.

Now, the crazy practices that are mentioned in the beginning of this thread seem to be taken out of context. Note that this was mentioned for ALL STARS ONLY. Does it seem crazy, maybe. Note that it's one more hour and one more day than regular rec ball. Regular rec ball around SoCal is 2 days out of the week for two hours with pitchers/catchers an extra half hour before or after practice. Then you have a third day in the week for batting cages....that is 2 cages running at the same time for 1.5 hours. double headers on saturdays. Now the cages and double headers might not be standard but many do that. The 2 hour x 2 a week is standard everywhere.

As far as other parts of the country catching up......no they are not!! They already have and have for some time now. Here in SoCal, we all know that and it's unbelievably great, only makes the sport we love that much better!!

FPMark, your assumption of a 6-8yr old superstar is totally incorrect. I can see why you would think that but at that age they are already playing 8u ball and half the team are really good. The gap between the good group is so small that the girls don't think about it. In all the years i've been around that division, one thing brings the biggest smile to their face and it's not all stars and it's not hits. It's a freaking change up for pitchers and sliding for everyone else!! I can't count how many times i've seen a girl on the mound literally jump smiling because her change up was not a strike or fooled the batter, just that she threw it correctly.
As far as superstars today growing into superstars in the future....who knows. What I can say is that the little superstars that i've grown up around have a deep deep love for the sport that can't even be explained. They don't fall off, they always have something to work on and work very hard at it.

Sorry for the long post, it just seems that there are a ton of misconceptions about SoCal fastpitch that i feel the need to jump in.

 

[Kevin Merryman]

My Drill Sargent comment was about this particular organization run by a particular person that berates kids to the point of crying on the field and pushes kids and even his own daughter to the point of quitting because of his own unfinished agenda's in his childhood.

I am quite the opposite on SoCa softball. I had the chance to witness one of these games as our 12U played a team from there. Let me just say...it wasn't even close for us. As long as the kids want it, and the parents are not pushing them to play, I am all for the practicing and playing as much as they want. My only issue comes when it is rammed down their kids throat and the child doesn't want to be there. That's all I am saying.

I just wish it would quit raining here and warm up so I can be outside getting ready!!!!

 

[SD DAD]

I completely agree with you Kevin and i don't know how it is over in Indiana or other parts of the country but i have a feeling that there's more of that here in SoCal then anywhere else. But that's not only the case with softball, that's with every other sport. Softball is a little different from my experiences. The kids here genuinely love the sport and it doesn't take much to get them going. Absolutely no problem keeping girls busy for 2 hours in regular rec level softball. It is also easy when you have a head coach, 2 assistants and roughly 4 moms and dads all wanting to help and always available.

you know Kevin, I can't begin to relate to the weather problems in your part of the country. I don't know what I would do!! I read another post I think from someone in Chicago and i'm just wowed by it. Around here, we get rained out once or twice all season. This season was pretty bad, I think we also missed out on two practices as well. But we are different over here. At least in my area, if it's 85 it's way too hot. If it's 70 you would swear just by looking at people that it was about to snow!!! and one drop of rain.....expect a 10 minute drive to last you one hour and storm watch 2011 on all the news channels!!