How do you throw a RISEBALL?

[Greenmonsters]

This is a bit alarming. I learned this in a graduate statistical analysis courses and then also use this principle throughout my long engineering career. I deal with this principle with co-workers and venders and customers alike (fairly standard stats stuff). I would suggest you might want to look into it. It is CRITICAL in making assumptions based on a data set.

Now a person COULD assume that you have a valid data set based on the number of overall pitches. I would disagree. In an extreme example one could analyze the flight off a single pitching machine up to a pitch count of a million. Would this mean you can make exacting conclusions on the flight of a softball?!?!? Absolutely not. I hope you can see this problem. You need to have pitches from a varying selection of pitchers that needs to be greater than or equal to 30 pitchers to have statistical significance to allow confidence in your data assumptions.



A MINIMAL number of pitchers should be 30. (and this data set of pitchers should be hand selected accomplished pitchers that have at least some indication from input from catchers/coaches/etc that "wow,...this pitcher has that late-break characteristic".) I submit that it IS that rare and it is directly attestable to an exacting speed/spin/angle on the pitch. I would be willing to bet large sums that there is a dynamic, like drag crisis, this IS occurring on some pitchers pitches.

Are we talking about the same MIT? The Myopic Institute of Technology's study I read found that Sir Isaac Newton got hit on the head by an apple was because he swung and missed due to late break.

 

[RubberBiscuit]

You question the validity and the statistical significance of the data that I have been using in support of my arguments. Yet at least I have data to support my arguments.

pobdude - My patience is failing me again here when I read this. Your position now is that the meer existence of data makes you right?!?!? . Are you kidding me...!?!? (if this aint another "tell".....) Our lives are FILLED TO THE BRIM with "data" that gets improperly used to produce misleading conclusions.

I mentioned before - I am just a plain ole bucket-dad with limited resources to do scientific procedure to produce counter-data.

If you don't want to check yourself here with the challenges I have made there is no more use in the discussion. (yes you addressed the surface of the Reynolds topic, with some good tidbits lending to that discussion, but then based on your data again you kicked that off the table without basis. AND then you fail to acknowledge the principles of statistical significance.)

I am officially done here too. You can go back to your monolithic preaching to your flock of sheeple without any inconvenience from me.

(Note that I am not angry - just passionate & expressive - if I met ya at some point pobdude I would buy ya a beer and we could talk more face to face which many times gets to a mutual conclusion much more efficiently than typing)

 

[Greenmonsters]

pobdude - My patience is failing me again here when I read this. Your position now is that the meer existence of data makes you right?!?!? . Are you kidding me...!?!? (if this aint another "tell".....) Our lives are FILLED TO THE BRIM with "data" that gets improperly used to produce misleading conclusions.

I mentioned before - I am just a plain ole bucket-dad with limited resources to do scientific procedure to produce counter-data.

If you don't want to check yourself here with the challenges I have made there is no more use in the discussion. (yes you addressed the surface of the Reynolds topic, with some good tidbits lending to that discussion, but then based on your data again you kicked that off the table without basis. AND then you fail to acknowledge the principles of statistical significance.)

I am officially done here too. You can go back to your monolithic preaching to your flock of sheeple without any inconvenience from me.

(Note that I am not angry - just passionate & expressive - if I met ya at some point pobdude I would buy ya a beer and we could talk more face to face which many times gets to a mutual conclusion much more efficiently than typing)

RB - I would love to join you and pobguy when you go out for beers. I am a scientist and work alongside many excellent engineers. Our different perspectives benefit both of us (at least that's what we tell each other). Unfortunately, while many of my colleagues do enjoy Scott Adam’s Dilbert cartoon, none of them have the passion for softball/baseball that is shared here on DFP.

 

[pobguy]

I am officially done here too. You can go back to your monolithic preaching to your flock of sheeple without any inconvenience from me.

(Note that I am not angry - just passionate & expressive - if I met ya at some point pobdude I would buy ya a beer and we could talk more face to face which many times gets to a mutual conclusion much more efficiently than typing)

Nor am I angry. Moreover, it was not my intention to drive you away from this discussion. Let's have that beer sometime and we can discuss in a relaxed atmosphere, perhaps at a baseball or softball game.

 

[JJsqueeze]

is it just me or did anyone else picture the professor and the skipper during this exchange. I watched waaayyy too much TV as a kid.

 

[3DD'sDAD]

Now that was interesting. A great read while watching some MLB. I especially enjoyed "pobdudes" (sorry but I couldn't help myself) points. Its nice to have a physicist chime in to substantiate the point - a human cannot throw a softball hard enough or with enough spin to upwardly change on its original path. No sharp break; no late break; no upward break at all. Is the horse still around? Let's wup on it some more. Sheesh!

 

[SoGASoftball]

Time for a Technical Pitching section...

 

[riseball]

^^^^ Like He Said ^^^^

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Nor am I angry. Moreover, it was not my intention to drive you away from this discussion. Let's have that beer sometime and we can discuss in a relaxed atmosphere, perhaps at a baseball or softball game.

You asked for data .... and I interpret the response you received to be that he didn't have supporting data.

 

[riseball]

Just when I thought this thread might die sans further bloviation.