Help with DD Push/Drive

[javasource]

Okie,

I see a lot of different 'styles' in this video... but the lack of fundamentals and adherence to one style is probably why you see so much inconsistency.

IMO, I'd eliminate everything she is doing before the circle and after the circle... and focus in on what needs to happen during the actual circle.

You're absolutely correct... there is soooo much information out there... and I can see how she is a sponge for visual cues... and a master at mimicry. IMO, you should take this strength of hers and turn it into instruction she will undoubtedly master. Rather than scour youtube... use the I/R threads and the images/videos in them as the tools. It's a single approach that your daughter is desperately seeking... provide it for her.

1. Work on the whip phase first.... just like BoardMember lays out in his perfect progressions. Get the free application called Kinovea... and show her those videos in his thread frame by frame. Have her do what he does. Perfect palm-to-sky, liberty and show it.
2. After the back part of her circle is lights out... show her how pitchers get their body open early. Have her mimic the opening sequence properly... and teach her to get her hand on top of the ball early.
3. I'll write up a new post in the Drive Mechanics thread this week that will help you with her drive/stride mechanics... as she has the sequence of the drive off the plate backwards.
4. Then show her the Drive Mechanics pictures and videos... and have her work on getting aggressive pushing off the plate.

Once you get all the fundamentals down... you can go back and add in some of those style points.

Lastly, this is a one-stop shopping kind of place. The quality threads posted here all promote (the majority that is) the same singular style. Read up on this stuff and gather the visuals she can learn from... she'll do great. ~JS

 

[okie]

Okie,

I see a lot of different 'styles' in this video... but the lack of fundamentals and adherence to one style is probably why you see so much inconsistency.

IMO, I'd eliminate everything she is doing before the circle and after the circle... and focus in on what needs to happen during the actual circle.

You're absolutely correct... there is soooo much information out there... and I can see how she is a sponge for visual cues... and a master at mimicry. IMO, you should take this strength of hers and turn it into instruction she will undoubtedly master. Rather than scour youtube... use the I/R threads and the images/videos in them as the tools. It's a single approach that your daughter is desperately seeking... provide it for her.

1. Work on the whip phase first.... just like BoardMember lays out in his perfect progressions. Get the free application called Kinovea... and show her those videos in his thread frame by frame. Have her do what he does. Perfect palm-to-sky, liberty and show it.
2. After the back part of her circle is lights out... show her how pitchers get their body open early. Have her mimic the opening sequence properly... and teach her to get her hand on top of the ball early.
3. I'll write up a new post in the Drive Mechanics thread this week that will help you with her drive/stride mechanics... as she has the sequence of the drive off the plate backwards.
4. Then show her the Drive Mechanics pictures and videos... and have her work on getting aggressive pushing off the plate.

Once you get all the fundamentals down... you can go back and add in some of those style points.

Lastly, this is a one-stop shopping kind of place. The quality threads posted here all promote (the majority that is) the same singular style. Read up on this stuff and gather the visuals she can learn from... she'll do great. ~JS

Great post and i look forward to your other ones.

We worked on some of the things i read in the IR thread last night after i showed her some of the videos. She really enjoyed playing underhanded catch, mostly because im horrible at it and shes not, lol. Still working on the rotation but getting away from the "hello elbow" finish showed immediate results as this is much more in line with her untaught throwing motion. Her response was that it was much more comfortable but as anticipated, she threw everything to the right or extreme left. On the bright side, her timing on her release point seemed to fix itself by throwing this way as everything was chin to shin, didnt throw many worm burners or any over the roof.

Im really starting to love this site but the downside is, it makes me feel like i know more than i actually do......lol

 

[okie]

Oh, another question i have about a problem i run into all of the time with her and im curious how you guys deal with it.

My DD is impatient with drills and working on single phase mechanics. For example, after two or three reps with something new, she wants to immediately go full windup to see if it works. I've tried to get her to understand that mastering each individual step will make the entire motion simple and thoughtless but she doesnt buy into it and wants to do the "whole" thing and if she cant, her mood changes.

What i settled on last night was do the drill twice, go through the entire motion dry and slow, then go full speed. Rinse and repeat. This worked for her but im curious, how long do you work on an individual step before allowing them to put it all together and is allowing them to go full speed during the learning process a bad thing?

 

[javasource]

Okie,

That desire to blast by the progressions is something every bucket dad/mom experiences... You know your dd best, so find a way to appeal to her. As a visual learner, maybe you take some video of her... telling her to review it and critique it. Have a goal to look exactly like BM (minus the khaki's and polo shirt) before you move on.

With all beginners, I tell them that the result of a full pitch will never be what you want UNTIL they learn to play catch underhand consistently. The true litmus test for her will be show-it... consistency in this progression usually transfers nicely to the full motion. This said, most people bail on lock it in and palm to sky way too early... and as such their whip is never what it could be. Don't let her skip those.

Missing to the right is the goal. With one student... I did the whole "Major League" (movie) target thing... having her put as many holes in a standing batter target as she could. Point being, her need to see thrown "strikes" was overwhelming... so we changed what a strike was for her, giving her an inside location and calling those strikes. We stayed at palm to sky (9 o'clock) for three weeks... and made the practice games so fun for her that we had to beg her to throw from show-it.

In the process, she learned to lead with the pinky, keeping her hand inside the bal... she learned to finish low in front of her body (told her to pretend their was a wrist laser that she needed to melt the catcher with after release)... she learned to pitch ACROSS her body, not around it (which is SO important)... she learned to lightly brush her side at release (helping with control, spin, and speed)... all to the point where she could TOSS (with proper i/r) to any target we gave her.

We kept the sessions to a daily routine of 30 minutes... this way, she was begging us for more - as opposed to us begging her for more.

Just some ideas... but again, you know your dd best...

 

[javasource]

Okie,

Although it's awesome to view the best in the world... sometimes it's more helpful to view other 'humans'...

This is one of my students and she's 10 years old. Should be really relative for your DD... and I recommend that you guys use this phenomenal student as a template for success as you learn. Her work ethic and support matrix at home make my job easy. Posting this video with permission... have your DD get to this point in the progressions:

Here's a check list for you:

• She starts palm to sky... hand under the ball.
• Nice bend - or flexion - of the elbow at start... and straightens into release of the ball.
• Leads with the pinky into release (hand is inside the ball at rear leg).
• Has great front side resistance, posture, etc...
• Lightly contacts her side.
• Throws across her body - not around... upper arm adducts into her side.
• Wrist laser melts the target.
• Notice the perfect spin axis, too...

This should be very helpful for her. Best ~ JS



.

 

[okie]

Okie,

Although it's awesome to view the best in the world... sometimes it's more helpful to view other 'humans'...

This is one of my students and she's 10 years old. Should be really relative for your DD... and I recommend that you guys use this phenomenal student as a template for success as you learn. Her work ethic and support matrix at home make my job easy. Posting this video with permission... have your DD get to this point in the progressions:

Here's a check list for you:

• She starts palm to sky... hand under the ball.
• Nice bend - or flexion - of the elbow at start... and straightens into release of the ball.
• Leads with the pinky into release (hand is inside the ball at rear leg).
• Has great front side resistance, posture, etc...
• Lightly contacts her side.
• Throws across her body - not around... upper arm adducts into her side.
• Wrist laser melts the target.
• Notice the perfect spin axis, too...

This should be very helpful for her. Best ~ JS



.

That girls 10, whats in the water in Western NY? Thanks for the clip.

My newest problem is what to do about a pitching coach. Ours got bent out of shape last night when my DD showed up throwing with a completely different philosophy then she had taught her, regardless of the fact that she was actually throwing well. When she started ripping my daughter about not finishing correctly (hello elbow) i pulled her aside and explained to her what we had worked on and why we were working on it. She stated that this is how you throw a drop curve, not a damn fastball and was very adamant about this type of rotation tearing up my DD's arm/shoulder.

Now, by admission the release phase is still a work in progress. Alot of times her spin is closer to 10/4 or 11/5 because sometimes she starts to rotate prior to the actual release point, something we're working on fixing. Im not fully understanding the PCs concerns about the injury because according to my DD (and my own trial), this seems to put less stress on the arm and the shoulder than trying to "lock" the entire arm straight and come straight through then back up. Because there were two other kids and sets of parents there i kept my mouth shut and the PC had her go back to throwing the old way for the rest of practice. You could tell by my DD's face that she was not happy about it showed in her poor pitching.

There are 3 other "prominent" PC's in our area and after practice i spent some time on the phone with two of them. It appears that they both teach the same method and have not heard nor know much about Natural Rotation or IR. The more i read and watch on the internet as well as the more i see my DD feel comfortable with this method, im becoming a believer myself. I am not convinced in any way that no matter how much research i do that i will be able to successfully continue to teach my daughter this philosophy. Because of this im kinda stuck in that scenario where you have an opinion on what you should do but that isnt practical with what you can do.

Is there an issue with me printing material from this forum, taking it to her PC and letting her read it to get a better understanding of what my DD and i are trying to do? Where i've ended up is in the end, im the one paying her so she can either teach my daughter the way i want or someone else can get my money.

 

[JJsqueeze]

All the information on the site is public and you can use as you wish....for instance, I print out entire threads from the TECH HITTING FORUM and use them to line my birdcage. Good luck with that though....many of us have gone down the road of attempting to share our enlightenment with others and it typically does not get received well. People do not like having their expertise challenged.

 

[Stand an]

Interview the other PCs you spoke of and find out if either would benefit you and your dd. if not then park it here, get a bucket, and be ready to learn a brainful.

 

[javasource]

Okie,

Sometimes it's better to stand-out from the crowd rather than blend in. This "Prominance" is often perpetuted through ignorance.... and ignorance is bliss.

Rather than try to convert others, you'll be more efficient and successful helping those that want to be helped... like your daughter. She is deserving of your time, because she values it.

A good PC comes across this style of teaching because they take the time to understand it... and desire to be better. Too many 'rest on their laurels'... and forget you are coming to them for instruction, not adulation. You will learn to spot them... but don't quit trying!

 

[okie]

Update:

Oh what a difference one week makes. After seeing my two consecutive practices where my DD has thrown harder and more consistently than before, her PC has come around and started to like this change to an IR motion. We still have a ton of work to do as she often starts rotating her wrist too soon and her stride is still weak but the results have her PC, her and myself very, very excited about what the future holds. The biggest and obvious difference is the increase in velocity shes getting. I dont have a gun but the 11 year old pitcher we faced last week is said to throw 45-50mph and no doubt my DD is at or exceeding that.

We had a game Tuesday night and i started another pitcher. This girl does more throwing than pitching and they are very slow meatballs but consistently gets the ball across the plate. As i usually do i let her go 2 innings with the other team hitting her well and our defense playing lights out. To start the 3rd inning my DD came in and this girl was throwing bullets! Her stride is still very inconsistent but the first two batters were bailing out of the box on all 3 strikes thrown to them. I shirt you not, the opposing coach actually came over and asked if we would put the other pitcher back in and give the bottom of his lineup a chance to hit (we were up 11-1). I understand its a rec league but my DD, just as all of our pitchers have put in the hours and work to earn the right to get those valuable reps on gameday. Im all for doing whats best for the girls but give me a break, im not pulling her. He was offended when i told my DD to finish the game throwing nothing other than changeups (which are still hotter than our 1st pitchers fastball). My DD was hot after the end of the game, she wasnt happy about the changeups and neither was momma, lol.

I just want to thank everyone here for the contributions. We have a LONG way to go but for the first time in awhile i got to see my confident daughter back on the field and every day shes more and more hungry to throw. This is a prime example of how helpful a site like this is and with improvements we have seen in just 2 weeks im excited to see how much more she can improve with the help of a knowlegeable group like this.

Thanks