Dad with some questions about my new pitcher?

[ArmWhip]

Let's not forget the the pitcher's Father posted on the website first and had some questions about how and what his daughter was being taught, that's being a prudent parent. He wanted feedback from the contributors on this site.

While having direct experience with what you teach doesn't guarantee good results, I believe it's an essential building block. Having practical experience builds both understanding and credibility.

This is debatable, but if this is what you belief what is your own personal direct experience for judging the replies to the Father's questions? Have you been a fastpitch pitcher, do you have a daughter who pitched or is pitching, are you an instructor? Many of the contributors on this site have at least one of these qualifications, some have all three.

is apparently teaching what the vast majority of top pitchers do,

Yes, many top pitchers throw bullet spin, as a riseball, and you think it's a good idea to try and teach a beginning 9 year old to try and throw a riseball like the 'top pitchers do'????? This and pulling the hip through are obvious red flags and one doesn't need to observe the instructor personally to tell the Father that he should proceed with caution and not just blindly go along with what his daughter is being taught.

 

[sluggers]

But the Judgment has already been passed and the perspective keeps revolving instead of evolving. (not saying people have to change what they teach to become what someone else's is teaching. But it's not the place to negate the other set of mechanics that can work)

IR is the only softball pitching mechanics that works. You can look at men's fastpitch, NCAA, Olympic, Japan pro, whatever. Everyone throws IR. It's been that way for at least 40 years.

It's much simpler to teach kids to throw IR rather than have to retrain them later.

 

[daywalkerdad]

This and pulling the hip through are obvious red flags

Is pulling the hip through bad? Or just being taught is bad?

I would say most pitchers pull the hip to some degree. Do not think the hip is in the way as long as long as the landing foot stays in front.

 

[RADcatcher]

softball pitching mechanics

Not sure why you attached your pitching preference to my post? My comment was directed at making assessments.

Like @Northball words
prefer people should ask why is that successful

 

[Tazman]

It may show it does not matter.
The ball goes up mainly from velocity and angle at release. Not as much from spin. If the pitch has less lift it will be compensated mainly by release angle being slightly higher.
I used an online calculator, top line is bullet spin, middle line is back spin. Bottom line is user error I could not remove.
There is only about 1-2” difference in path. I think once you account for spin efficiency of backspin, and if bullet spin generated any wake effect, or has some backspin it will be close.
So the better pitch will be which one the pitcher throws faster and locates better more than added lift from backspin.

I was recently at a camp of a top 20 program. The head coach spent about 2 hours with pitchers parked in front of a rapsodo analyzing their data. On a rise ball they are trying to get 8+ inches of deviation from path (this is measured as vertical break on the rapsodo) at elite levels (most recruits are at 1-2 inches if they even have a rise she said). That's a huge difference for a hitter who can't just look at trajectory. The rapsodo breaks it down by spin efficiency (direction) and rpm. I think we saw this at clearwater where high fast pitches got crushed but a good rise with axis + rpm was still effective. Near perfect back spin is exceedingly rare but possible and more effective than bullet spin for the rare bird that can throw it with velocity.

 

[lostcreek1]

This was my initial thought. IMO spin is such a non issue at this age.

Beginners should not be shown the correct way to spin the ball when being taught whatever pitch they are learning? I don't understand that at all.

 

[lostcreek1]

Similar situation with my DD. I asked her a year or so age if she wanted to be a “pitcher” or a “softball player”. She said she wanted to be a softball player so we shifted focus away from pitching and more into hitting/fielding. She still pitches for our travel team as the #3, but we out more time into the other areas for sure.

I have often wondered at what age a girl should decide I am going to be a pitcher, catcher etc. and devote most of your time to that and hitting. Seems it may be younger than I previously thought.

 

[bsbs]

My daughter moved up 12u a year early. Her coaches used to say how much her fastball moved. The only reason it moved was because her hands were small and she was never releasing it correctly or consistently. I didn't put much effort into proper spins at that age.

 

[tomorrow]

Beginners should not be shown the correct way to spin the ball when being taught whatever pitch they are learning? I don't understand that at all

Well, for beginners in this age group they are not learning "a pitch" they are learning to pitch. Why bog down the learning process with spin axis. How to hold the ball and which fingers are used is all that needs to be addressed. Adults like to talk about spin and ball movement but at 35 feet the only thing that matters is location and speed.

 

[lostcreek1]

Well, for beginners in this age group they are not learning "a pitch" they are learning to pitch. Why bog down the learning process with spin axis. How to hold the ball and which fingers are used is all that needs to be addressed. Adults like to talk about spin and ball movement but at 35 feet the only thing that matters is location and speed.

I would prefer for them to be taught the correct spins from the beginning, even if it don't move. A lot harder to break habits than to teach correctly the first time. Just my .02