"Hands" terminology

[RayR]

One of the hands cues that I really hate is.... " keeping the hands inside the ball ", or keeping the hands inside the path of the ball. That is a cue that just doesnt make any sense, because if you get your hands outside the path of the ball, you are going to get hit in the forearm with the pitch.

It's really another way of saying don't cast/sweep. Once the hands get outside the path of the ball they have to slice back inside. No one is suggesting (at least I hope not) that you would hit the ball with your forearm.

Try this drill: Put a nerf football in a red party cup on the ground and have your player try and hit the football. Watch their hand path. It is illuminating.

I bet that your hitters will pull the football and probably miss the ball the first time. The goal is to hit the football up the middle and then hit it opposite side.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

One of the hands cues that I really hate is.... " keeping the hands inside the ball ", or keeping the hands inside the path of the ball. That is a cue that just doesnt make any sense, because if you get your hands outside the path of the ball, you are going to get hit in the forearm with the pitch.

Perhaps it would it make more sense to you to have a "tight hand pivot point".

 

[cshilt]

One of the hands cues that I really hate is.... " keeping the hands inside the ball ", or keeping the hands inside the path of the ball. That is a cue that just doesnt make any sense, because if you get your hands outside the path of the ball, you are going to get hit in the forearm with the pitch.

Makes more sense to me than, "take your hands to the ball." What are we doing, hitting the ball with the knob of the bat?

 

[bosoxfan]

you could say have the hands make the pizza as long as the girls know what you want them to do when you say it

 

[Not_Enuf_Mustard]

I think my problem is I haven’t picked a camp yet. I read what’s posted here, I read Steve Englishbey’s board, Jack Mankin’s board I have seen the Candrea videos. There are some subtle and some not so subtle differences in all of them. It’s surprising to see how many different views there are on hitting and how strongly some people feel about those views.

I have spoken with Steve Englishbey several times. I’d like to get him to here for a clinic. If I can’t get enough interest, I’ll just buy his videos. Does anyone have any experience with Steve or own his videos?

 

[Chris O'Leary]

I think my problem is I haven’t picked a camp yet. I read what’s posted here, I read Steve Englishbey’s board, Jack Mankin’s board I have seen the Candrea videos. There are some subtle and some not so subtle differences in all of them. It’s surprising to see how many different views there are on hitting and how strongly some people feel about those views.

At the end of the day, the best thing to do is to see how people's ideas match up to video, and in particular to multiple videos and good videos.

If something truly is important, you should see it everywhere, not just in a couple of clips.

 

[Ken Krause]

It will also require some experimentation to see what works for you and your hitters. As I keep saying, there isn't a "right" way -- at least not yet. There are a lot of ideas and some seem to be better than others, or are more used than others. But just because something isn't popular doesn't mean it isn't right.

Keep in mind that if you looked at how the "best in the world" performed the high jump in 1967, you would not have seen the technique that is primarily in use today - the so-called Fosbury Flop. Hitting is still evolving.

 

[RayR]

Mustard, my advice is to not limit yourself to one "camp." When you think there is nothing else to learn or that the answer lies within one source you are cheating yourself and your students. And if you ask any of the gurus where their ideas came from I am sure that if pressed they would admit from studying from a variety of sources.

My views come from working with enough players at different levels and skill aptitude. What works for one does work for all. Currently I work with about 15-20 different players on the weekends (some personal lessons other team environment). I have "borrowed" drills and queue's from anyone and everyone in an effort to get my players to hit better. Notice I did not say swing because in the end it is about how they hit not swing.

For me, it comes down to bat control. I don't think anyone can argue with this, but many drills seem to focus on how the body moves or matching up movements to elite players. Using video is fine, but it still comes down to how a player controls their bat.

 

[tom.guerry]

CO said :

"If something truly is important, you should see it everywhere, not just in a couple of clips."

I would add a few personal caveats.

1- skills are organized by the body using one of a number of patterns as a template. these patterns are inborn and are recognized in retrospect by analysis of a large cohort of practitioners

2-once the individual is sorted into a pattern, then comparing/contrasting is much more useful

3-what you see should not contradict a description of the universals of the pattern, but what is seen may have a different appearance due to individual style which will emphasize different aspects of the pattern. the pattern will include requirements where one action is balanced and/or opposed by another so the surface apperance results from a summation/synch that can have variable surface apperance.

4-with regard to fastpitch hitting, I would recommend emulating the swing of the best MLB hitters IF the player can learn a high level overhand throw (not by any means a given).

5-the swing pattern of proficent MLB power hitters is surprisingly consistent with very little variation as opposed to what works at the highest levels of golf or high jump,etc. you do not see a recent Fosbury flop appear in MLB. Unlike golf, only 1 pattern works, not both 1 and 2 plane (Hardy) or hitting vs swinging (TGM).

a goal would be to teach swing and throw together, likewise there is only 1 basic overhand power throw pattern which is also best seen in MLB, especially pure underspin fastball.

 

[Hitter]

It will also require some experimentation to see what works for you and your hitters. As I keep saying, there isn't a "right" way -- at least not yet. There are a lot of ideas and some seem to be better than others, or are more used than others. But just because something isn't popular doesn't mean it isn't right.

Keep in mind that if you looked at how the "best in the world" performed the high jump in 1967, you would not have seen the technique that is primarily in use today - the so-called Fosbury Flop. Hitting is still evolving.

Ken

You are correct.

The kids do not think there is or was any other way to do it until you point out that at one time there was no other way to do it.

It has nothing to do with hitting as it is a mind set projected upon the hitters by people who have a theory that may not actually work with kids as to getting them to see it, feel it or fix it.

It is ironic that we got a man on the moon and even more so that we got them back and still have not figured out how to hit a baseball or softball and if a rise ball really rises!

I could not help myself!

Thanks Howard