Compromising your swing

[fosterspoint]

A couple of the recent threads got me thinking about something. Some comments on the Model Swing thread said that these clips show a lot of differences in the swing mechanics, even though all of the players in the clips are successful.

Another thread talked about the difference in bat speed between fastpitch and slowpitch softball. The thread says that a slowpitch swing generates more bat speed because the hitter is not as constrained. A slowpitch hitter has more time to load up, take a powerful stride and a strong swing. A fastpitch hitter has to swing quick enough to hit a 60 mph inside riseball while also covering the plate for an outside drop curve or changeup.

So, is every swing a compromise from the ideal swing? Given the time, speed, location and ball movement constraints, is there really an ideal swing?

The ideal swing for bat speed should be close to the slowpitch swing, because they have all day to track the ball and swing. The ideal swing for putting the ball in play would be close to a bunt because you have so much bat control. But neither of these are the best for everday fastpitch hitting.

I don't know where I was going on this thread. Just got me thinking that there is no ideal swing for fastpitch. Every swing has compromises to allow the hitter to adjust to the speed and location of the pitch. Some swings compromise the load up, the stride, or the bat speed. Maybe there are some absolutes regarding good mechanics, but I am starting to believe that there is no perfect swing for fastpitch. I guess that's why we keep working on swing mechanics, we are always looking for an improvement, but no one ever gets to the ideal swing.

 

[Hitter]

A couple of the recent threads got me thinking about something. Some comments on the Model Swing thread said that these clips show a lot of differences in the swing mechanics, even though all of the players in the clips are successful.

Another thread talked about the difference in bat speed between fastpitch and slowpitch softball. The thread says that a slowpitch swing generates more bat speed because the hitter is not as constrained. A slowpitch hitter has more time to load up, take a powerful stride and a strong swing. A fastpitch hitter has to swing quick enough to hit a 60 mph inside riseball while also covering the plate for an outside drop curve or changeup.

So, is every swing a compromise from the ideal swing? Given the time, speed, location and ball movement constraints, is there really an ideal swing?

The ideal swing for bat speed should be close to the slowpitch swing, because they have all day to track the ball and swing. The ideal swing for putting the ball in play would be close to a bunt because you have so much bat control. But neither of these are the best for everday fastpitch hitting.

I don't know where I was going on this thread. Just got me thinking that there is no ideal swing for fastpitch. Every swing has compromises to allow the hitter to adjust to the speed and location of the pitch. Some swings compromise the load up, the stride, or the bat speed. Maybe there are some absolutes regarding good mechanics, but I am starting to believe that there is no perfect swing for fastpitch. I guess that's why we keep working on swing mechanics, we are always looking for an improvement, but no one ever gets to the ideal swing.

This is a statement in general and has nothing to do with the person who posted the thread.

From the net...."So there are several cognitive factors that affect hitting, what about the visual aspect of hitting? (Hofeldt, 1993) implied that visual ability as measured by stereo photometry accounts for 47% or more of the variation in batting averages of the Major League players."

So if vision is so important that it has a 47% factor associated to it then what elements would comprise the other 53%?

Most feel up to toe touch is style and not mechanics and if we try to teach stance, balance, load we are cookie cutting the swing.

Would you like fries with your happy meal? When they get older they can create their style however unless they are hitting the ball they will probably take up soccer!

How you load will effect your vision and how you stride can affect your vision however hand path is normally the issue everyone wants to tackle.

With all of this good information on hitting you would have thought the MLB batting averages would be at least .300 however it has stayed around .257 to .270 for a long time, so maybe you need to coach at the MLB level if you have a solution to raising the averages and if hand path is so important how can they look ugly and hit the heck out of the ball doing it?

I use a Swing Speed Radar Unit and have found most kids swing in the 54 to maybe 59 MPH as measured from the sweet part of the bat.

Crystl swings around 79 MPH and AP swings around 86.99 MPH per GQ Sept.06.

Most of my kids less than 18 years old swing around 58 to 68 and the older kids are in the 72 MPH range.

Since I took martial arts, in my world there is a hip thrust prior to rotation and if you ask Crystl at a clinic, she would explain she focuses on driving off the big toe and the toe next to it prior to rotation by lifting the heel and I will take her word that is what she feels.

From the net..."Center Rotation. The essence of all Martial Arts moves is the rotation of your body’s center. In China, they speak of rotating the waist and in Japan they call it turning the hips, but the essence of the motion of the rotation of the body’s exact center which rotates to generate power much like an axle turns the wheel at either end but with the added benefit that you can use your muscles to control the timing of the rotation relative to the strike. This allows for thrust techniques, where the rotation is behind the strike, and snap techniques, where the initial rotation precedes the strike and the counter-rotation, or reversal, begins well before extension to create a whip-like action. "

We do this by rotating as needed and releasing the barrel to the ball based on the balls depth in box.

While perfection of the elite MLB swing pattern is being sought and purified and defined, you are correct they are still hitting the ball and some are better than others.

Some one needs to tell the MLB hitters they need to increase their averages or they have flawed swings no matter what video or player they are studying as they are not getting it or the averages would be higher!

Howard

 

[redhotcoach]

I think there are basics and the rest is a matter of opinion. I would bet that you couldn't post a video of someone/anyone's swing on here that somebody doesn't find something wrong with.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Some one needs to tell the MLB hitters they need to increase their averages or they have flawed swings no matter what video or player they are studying as they are not getting it or the averages would be higher!

Hitter, this seems to be a reoccurring theme of yours.

I respect that you tend to place a focus on athletic efficiency. That said, what are the MLB pros “not getting” and how much higher would their averages be if they “got it”?

Do you view it as possible that the best MLB hitters have gravitated to using certain mechanics … because it allows them the greatest amount of success?

 

[Hitter]

Hitter, this seems to be a reoccurring theme of yours.

I respect that you tend to place a focus on athletic efficiency. That said, what are the MLB pros “not getting” and how much higher would their averages be if they “got it”?

Do you view it as possible that the best MLB hitters have gravitated to using certain mechanics … because it allows them the greatest amount of success?

If hitting is a process and you document the swing mechanics, then what are they doing wrong that they can not improve their averages with all of the wonderful information that we have discovered?

My reoccurring theme is until they hit, it is mechanics over style and that is never popular as it is cookie cutting.

Why is it that only a handful of hitters get it and put up the big numbers and the rest of the MLB players do not get it that keeps the averages below .270?

When you see the model swings, especially in fast pitch and the numbers are above .300 as a team batting average, then wouldn't you would wonder why that hitting coach is doing better than a coach that has a team batting average of lets say .273?

Now what is the hitting instructor teaching his team that the other hitting instructor is not doing or does not believe in about the hitting process?

You can usually see it in the teams general approach to hitting and the team philosophy when you see the team hit.

Again I see hitting as a process and when hand path is singled out without the rest of the body being in sequence it is a correctable flaw and then hand path is a work in process.

When I see a girl go from travel ball to college and do well it makes me smile as I feel she has a foundation from which to build from.

When I see a person like John Taschida have the results he has had over the years by laying a foundation and building from there it makes me smile even more as he is not an MLB hitting instructor, however he has tremendous insight about the swing and how to teach it and whenever we talk it is always about laying the foundation.

The MLB elite swing may be the goal or the pattern however who and how it is taught is a whole different ball game in my opinion.

My girls that started with me at 11 and 12 years old are now graduating college and it makes me smile!

They got it!

How do MLB players define success? Just because they got there or would you think being able to hit at least .300 would involve some incentives in their contract?

What again is the reason no one has been able to increase the averages if hitting is so easy to understand?

Name your instructor and then what is or not in their technique that any MLB player could not improve their swing?

Howard

 

[softballphreak]

I've been studying hitting pretty intensely for about 10 years now. What I have learned is that there are a number of things that play into being successful at hitting.

Just like riding a bicycle, there are many ways to swing. The more efficient you become the better chance you have of hitting the ball. I have yet to see a team anywhere that uses the same technique. John Tschida's team at the D3 nationals in Raleigh, NC, is the closest I've seen; and they were great!

There is great advice on this site; no doubt about that! But no matter how close to perfect the batters get there is one thing they can't control--the pitcher! One of the pitcher's main jobs is to keep the batter off balance. Therefore, the only perfect swing will happen by chance. The key is to be prepared as well as possible to increase the chances of hitting the ball the way you want to hit it!

Practice and experiment with a variety of techniques to be prepared for whatever comes from the one factor you can't control--the pitcher.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Hitter, I’m still curious what you believe the best MLB hitters are “not getting” and how much higher their averages would be if they “got it”.

You commented that it was “mechanics over style” … but you left it at that. What would you have MLB hitters do differently that would improve their averages?

 

[Hitter]

Hitter, I’m still curious what you believe the best MLB hitters are “not getting” and how much higher their averages would be if they “got it”.

You commented that it was “mechanics over style” … but you left it at that. What would you have MLB hitters do differently that would improve their averages?

I will leave that to you Mankin, Epstein, Englishby and the other gurus however Slaught came out of the chair and took the Tigers to an ALC championship in one year.

Review the film.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Hitter, it is you that claims that the MLB professional hitters “are not getting it or the averages would be higher!”. That is not my claim.

It appears that you don’t have an answer as to what you believe the MLB professional hitters “don’t get”.

As an FYI, Don Slaught was the Detroit Tiger’s hitting coach in 2006.

In 2005 the Tiger’s team BA was 0.272.

In 2006 the Tiger’s team BA was 0.274.

 

[tom.guerry]

as a comparison, Williams took over the Senators in 1969, BA went from 224 to 251, perhaps enhanced by expansion, 9th out of 10 teams in 1968, third out of 12 in batting average in 1969, wikipedia:

The year 1969 was a turning point in Washington sports history. The Senators named Ted Williams as manager. The Washington Redskins hired Vince Lombardi as Head Coach and he had brought a winning attitude to the nation's capital. In the same year, the nearby University of Maryland had hired Lefty Driesell to coach basketball. It marked a renaissance in sports interest in America's most transient of cities. The hiring of Ted Williams sparked at least increased curiosity in the team. Williams' fanatic approach to hitting helped improve the Senators offense considerably, and inspired the team to its one and only winning season during its 10-year stay in Washington. For this remarkable turnaround, Williams was voted American League Manager of the Year. (Note: This was the only award that Ted Williams had ever won, but Joe DiMaggio had not.) As a result, attendance at RFK Stadium improved to over 900,000, the best attendance record the "new" Senators ever had