Bottom of the roster

[NorthMS]

In ours, the same 4 girls sub every game. The line up is generally the same. In bracket play, I completely get it. In pool play, I wouldn't mind seeing the line up rotated a bit. My DD joined mid season and was needed for a #2 pitcher. She's performed that duty well. She's coming from rec ball, so her hitting and fielding are behind some of the others. We've got about 4 girls that I've never seen get 2 AB's in one game. Is it common for the pool game to be played different than bracket play? I figured it would be.

Also, while I wouldn't mind seeing it a bit different, I have not brought it up once to the coach or anybody else. It's not a huge deal to me.

 

[Slappers]

I place a lot of value on effort and reliability. Long story short, I had a parent email me saying I told her DD that she would be pitching the next day (she didn't) and that I added girls to the team and show no loyalty. This was after a tournament a few weeks ago.

I don't add players indiscriminately. I had two girls leave and another that was going on a school trip to France. That left me with 9 players for this last weekends tournament. I told her first and foremost, I had a commitment to every player on the team, not just hers and that is my responsibility to have enough players to field a team with reserves when we all know temps in the end of June can get pretty high. I refuse to abuse kids and have them catch three games in 90+ degree weather and high humidity.

Secondly, I told her that she has made it to only 75% of the practices and has been late to 75% of those. I value work ethic and the ability to get to practices. One excuse was that I got was that her other daughter left something she needed in her car so she turned around to take it back and traffic was "just too bad" to come back....

This player is lazy. She wants to pitch and will by default because the HS she goes to has no one else to. I spent hours coming up with a plan to help develop her and she just doesn't do it. It isn't hard to tell. I asked her one day if she has been practicing and she said it was hard because she has a "couch calling her name". I told her then she has a bench calling her name too.

I put myself in the situation. She should have been cut, and will be but I try not to blame the kids for the failings of their parents but she also doesn't put in the required effort. She plays slow pitch as well (whole other story) and is the top hitter and one of that leagues better players. She can't hit the broad side of a barn door for us obviously and she just feels better knowing she doesn't have to work on her game because she is at the top of the local slowpitch league.

I made the conscious decision to keep her for our entire season. I picked her because she has the athletic ability to really excel. I was hoping I could encourage her enough to get her working hard and get better. I couldn't.

I let her play in the outfield and even pitch a game this weekend. She did ok pitching. I didn't use the pick up player unless I needed her as that is what she signed up for.

That is the reason she is on the bottom of the roster and gets what she gets. Even though she is as talented as some of the other girls I play, if not more so, they come to practices, work hard and try to learn the game. They get the most playing time. If you are sitting, it isn't because I don't think you have the ability, it is because you got outworked and showed you want to be there.

 

[RetiredCoach]

I made the conscious decision to keep her for our entire season. I picked her because she has the athletic ability to really excel. I was hoping I could encourage her enough to get her working hard and get better. I couldn't.

I've run into this problem many times with players. I believe that I can spot physical talent easily. I can sense what a girl might be capable of provided she put in the work. However, I can't always tell which girls will put in the work. Unless you have some history with the girl, it's hard to tell whether she will put in the work and be dedicated to excel.

 

[starsnuffer]

Stop trying to defend your coach. Any time a player or a parent questions you on your management, your answer should always be "I did what I felt is best for the team. I'll take your comments under advisement, but I will continue to do what is best for the team".

The reason you're not playing the kid is because you don't want them on the team, so why try to make them feel better about it.

-W

 

[SamRam]

This is a post that I've shared previously on our local chat board at KC Fastpitch. Hope it is helpful.

One thing I will add to what is below, I don't have discussions with parents about playing time. If I get a call about playing time, I let them know we are doing what is best for the team, and then I suggest to the parent to have a conversation with their daughter about whether our team is the right fit for them. If they ask once, they will ask again, but this usually puts an end to the discussion. One caveat, I do consider myself lucky and grateful to have 10 ball players I can use at almost all positions. I will carry a few more heading into 16U in the fall.

***************************************************************************************************

As a coach, let me tell you, that this is a very delicate issue. I coach a second year 14A team. My goal in putting our team together was to get the best group of girls together, that want to play at a high level, but who also compliment each other on the field and want to play for each other. It has taken me and our coaching staff a long time to get to a point where we feel that we have the right mix of girls. I can honestly say, that I have a very special group.

Part of having the right mix of girls is also having the girls that have the right mind set about how the team functions as a group, and what their role is on the team. Each of my girls can play at any position we ask them to, outside of pitcher and catcher. This is a very important point, because if you have the right athletes, who genuinely care about the team and care about each other, they will do whatever they can to help the team succeed. No questions asked. That doesn't mean that you aren't going to have a conversation or two, about where or how much they play, but it usually isn't coming from them.

Now throw in the task of trying to help each of these girls pursue their dreams of playing at the collegiate level, and it becomes even more of a delicate situation. This year we will be playing about half of our schedule in invitational or showcase type tournaments. So I believe that it becomes even more important that our players embrace their roles, play where we ask them, and make sure we are doing our part to get the word out about their play. Who wants their daughter to go to a showcase and not play and not be given an opportunity to show their skills to college coaches?

Now about this whole focus on winning and losing. Everyone wants to win, nobody likes to lose. If you are a player and competing on an A level softball team, I trust that you understand that your daughter is there to play and compete each and every weekend at the highest level. So if you are focusing on who plays where, and who hits and doesn't hit in bracket play, and who should be sitting the bench, and why one girl got more mound time than another, you are really missing out on a lot. You are not going to win every game, and you are not going to collect a trophy every weekend. And guess what, some times you are going to beat teams and lose to teams that are way better than you, and you are going to beat teams and lose to teams that aren't as good as you are. It just happens. The question is, did your daughter do everything she could to help her team win? Was her effort, her attitude, and her heart all that she could give? I would say in most cases it is, but focusing on the win/loss probably causes a lot of us to over look what they did on the field.

 

[Momo'sDad]

Stop trying to defend your coach. Any time a player or a parent questions you on your management, your answer should always be "I did what I felt is best for the team. I'll take your comments under advisement, but I will continue to do what is best for the team".

The reason you're not playing the kid is because you don't want them on the team, so why try to make them feel better about it.

Coaches have to manage the way they know how. They cannot and should not be expected to manage teams the way a given parent wants. You're correct in every way there.

But I disagree about making the 'unwanted' player feel better. NV has younger teams and if a 10u/12u coach takes a player, then he's taking on the responsibility of developing her. I'm not saying that every player gets equal time, even on a developmental level team, but I am saying that coaches of non-elite teams should not be in the business of trying to create roster space by making the less talented player's experience a lot less fun than her teammates'. If a player has checked out on her team, that's 1 thing, but if she's putting in the work, then the coach needs to get her onto the field. For the non-elite teams, the stakes just aren't that high.

 

[Momo'sDad]

There are very few absolutes in this discussion, but despite being an unreasonable parent in the stands, I will do my best to share a reasonable coaching perspective here. Two key assertions that I see no argument on:

1) I say it all the time here, but for those who have not seen my rants before, every program has different goals. Coaches have an obligation to outline those goals prior to offering roster spots to anyone when a team is being formed. That does not mean that the plan may not change, but it's important to begin with a plan and that the plan be clearly communicated to anyone who may wish to have their daughter on your team.

2) Regardless of what a team's goals are, a coach's job is to develop their players. The methods for achieving this will vary greatly, depending on the age of a team and the goals themselves. A 16u showcase team is managed very differently from a 12u team that's looking to be competitive locally and to get the entire roster ready to play for a decent 14u team. A top 18u team might not ever take the field together outside of showcase play.

something my wife said about team sports:
it prepares the youth for the adult world. it teaches youth, how to win, how to lose, how to work as a team, how to handle disappointment, how to handle stress.

if a coach is not using sports to prepare a player for the adult world, then that coach is doing that player a major disservice. it is not all about winning, the best "coaches" know this.

not agreeing or disagreeing with anyone

You're disagreeing with Easton33 and there is nothing wrong with that. Own it. I disagree with him on this, too.

 

[Momo'sDad]

Couldn't disagree more. This is low level rec mentality imo. What does the most talented player deserve? A spot on the team? Sounds like that is exactly what the least talented player on your team got too. It should be very easy to see who works hard on their own out of your presence. No need to track it, they should be showing it in practice and games. Try playing the best 7 and subbing 8-11 with each other. The most talented kid on your team is getting the same playing time as the worst. Where is that gonna happen in real life. Someone made the comment about adults getting involved and messing up playing time yada yada yada. The problem is that little Sally's dad got involved and started preaching equal this and that because little Sally just wasn't a good enough player to earn a starting 9 spot. You will never make everyone happy at this game. The only thing you can do is be true to the game. Best 9 plays, if the players on the bench don't like it, they can get better and earn their spot. What does the weakest player on your team deserve? When did "team" sports become about individual playing time?

How many elite teams are there in the country at each age division? By 'elite', I'm not talking about the best team in your town. I'm talking about the best teams anywhere, teams that are going to go to Nationals (the real Nationals, not the Disney version) and likely to make a deep run. Even if we say that every state has 2 such teams, with states like FL, GA, TX, AZ, and CA having a few more, that's still no more than 125 teams. Speaking realistically, however, it could be safely argued that maybe only 40 of them have a legitimate shot at a top-8 finish.

So, regardless of a coach's ego, chances are that any given TB coach is NOT managing 1 of those 40 teams. However, even the coaches of these teams know they are not going to go into Bloomington or San Diego and win with only 9 players. The reality is that most teams are 1 injury away from being a lot less competitive than they are at full strength. Few teams have the ability to recruit real depth. It has to be developed, even on elite teams.

For many teams that are just below that top tier, it's very reasonable to expect that the coaches WANT to get to that next level. So, as a parent, I expect that the team will be managed quite similarly to those top teams. That means that the goal of the fall season of the 2nd year in 10u/12u/14u is to fully assess the team and part of that means figuring out which players to keep or let go prior to making a run at a Nationals qualification in the spring. In order to do that, everyone's got to play quite a bit. Regardless of whether roster changes are made in Nov/Dec, the spring season gets gradually more competitive as the team peaks towards its final summer tourney. Coaches and parents of these teams shouldn't worry about a late March tourney result and everyone should see the field plenty, but once they hit Memorial Day, it's possible that there may be fewer and fewer Sunday plate appearances for players not in the starting 9. Sure, many coaches would LOVE for the #12 batter to be interchangeable with #3, but such a situation is just a fantasy for most teams, though.

 

[Carsonsig]

I have fallen in to the start the same 6, rotate the other 6 sitting or starting this summer... but the drop off for me is SOOO huge from 1-7 to 7-14 that I cant really play a plausible infield if I sit any of my top half.... with absences and stuff, girls are getting time... but some have played nearly all or all my innings. I was honest about this at the start of my season.

 

[NVfishing]

Our coaches are doing a good job of rotating the new players. As some have said, some girls put more effort in on and off the field. Some girls need seasoning. The practice of this season to be ready next season. They all get playing time but some more than others. Any good ways to calm parents? They tend to be the ones with the problem not the girls.