Beginning Catcher's Questions

[Wookie]

DD is 10 playing on U10 travel and rec teams. She's a part time catcher for both and has gotten some, in my opion, confusing coaching on what to do. First off, one travel coach (head) doesn't want her to take any additional steps other than stepping with the left foot towards 2nd, while another travel team coach (assistant) wants her to "skateboard" (right foot replacing left foot and getting into proper throwing position) for the throw. HC's theory is for every step she takes the runner is at least taking the same number of steps, whereas AC's theory is the girls at this age can't get it there on time and need the additional steps. All three travel catchers, even the one with the best arm, are one-hopping them in. Also, HC does NOT want any catcher throwing if they do not receive it clean, i.e. if it's bobbled or blocked = no throw.

I have Dave Weaver's DVD (great, btw) and there is no mention of the to throw/not to throw discussion, but he does teach the "half skateboard", if you will, so I'm on board with that, but I'd like to know everyone's thoughts on the not throwing if it's not received cleanly argument. My opinion is - how are they going to learn the bobbled throw if it's not practiced?

Also, the AC is teaching the 2B/SS to wait for the ball to arrive at the base. My opinion is by waiting you create a ball-runner-glove triangle arriving at the same time. I'd like input from the crowd on this as well since I think you go get it first then make the tag.

I don't want this info to argue with the coaches. I need it to reinforce with DD as well as to teach those on the rec team the correct techniques.

Thanks.

 

[absdad]

If the runner goes, the catcher throws. I've witnessed plenty of stealers thrown out on blocked balls. It really depends on the catcher. If they are quick and precise in their movements, they should be able to get the ball there with minimal fumbling. If they are having too much wasted movement, and wasting time, then it probably isn't wise to throw and risk a miss or overthrow. That may be what the coaches were talking about.

 

[Wookie]

I don't think that is what he was talking about. The first attempt DD almost threw the girl out - missed by 1/2 step. HC told her "I told you not to throw unless you catch it". A few batters later, same thing except the runner would have been out if not for the lack of SS being able to catch a one-hopper knee high from 7 ft away. Again, HC said "I told you not to throw unless you catch it cleanly".

I agree - runner goes, you throw. In the rec league we actually have watered down rules (no advancement on overthrows) to encourage them to throw. They played their first travel games this past weekend after never having any full field (or fulll infield) practice so I thought it should have been the best time to actually practice throwing to 2nd in all situations.

I don't want to confuse DD nor go against the HC, but I'd like to know when is she going to get that practice if not in a mid-Feb indoor tournament.

 

[absdad]

I don't think that is what he was talking about. The first attempt DD almost threw the girl out - missed by 1/2 step. HC told her "I told you not to throw unless you catch it". A few batters later, same thing except the runner would have been out if not for the lack of SS being able to catch a one-hopper knee high from 7 ft away. Again, HC said "I told you not to throw unless you catch it cleanly".

No offense, but that sounds like bad coaching to me. I can't imagine why they'd be against it, other than being worried about a miss or an overthrow. At the very minimum, it will not be a green light to runners. After a few attempts, they will know that if they go, they will be racing the throw. Psychologically, that will cause some girls to pause and look, or to not attempt it. I've seen too many games where the catcher was always way late, or never attempted, and every girl on the team stole at will.

 

[SnocatzDad]

I agree with making the throw regardless of catching cleanly. Also agree with waiting at the bag to receive the throw on a steal to 2B. As their arm strength goes up ball is moving much quicker than the feet of the receiver. The ball has to travel 84 feet and when the ball leaves the catchers hand the runner is probably 20-30 ft from 2B. At most you can come towards the catcher the length of the runners body so that your tagging their head prior to feet reaching base, but that leaves you open to a good hook slide. A hook slide does no good if your waiting at the bag with the ball. Other thing that happens on blocked balls is that it's a late start for the stealer, they didn't go on the pitch, they left on the bobble, that buys you another second to gather the ball and throw them out.

The thing that really bothers me is the message that is sent to players by this type of coaching, "don't throw on a bobble" = i'm afraid of you or the girl your throwing to committing an error. Same thing as "don't swing on a 3-0 count" "we only allow one overthrow, after that we get the ball back to the pitcher" "Don't make the throw unless you're sure" "we only pitch our #1 pitcher" All of that feeds into the fear of failure and you end up with kids afraid to make plays, afraid to swing a bat because some coach would rather win a game playing it "safe" than allow kids to play without fearing failure and accept winning or losing as a result.

 

[ctfastpitch]

I think if the runner was already on the move for a steal, and the catcher doesn't catch it cleanly, then the odds of throwing her our are pretty low...so why risk the ball getting by and giving up another base (you might make a different decision with two outs...since it would take a base hit to score the runner from 3B). If, on the other hand the runner takes off on the bobble, then a good throw stands a pretty good chance of getting the out, and it is worth a shot.

Definitely agree with the receiver waiting for the throw on the bounce, rather that going to get it (assuming it's on line). The ball is going to get to the bag much faster than the fielder can if she moves out in front.

 

[D.G. OutLaws 16u]

Catchers are "quarterbacks".
As your DD matures in this position she will know when and when not to throw(bobbled or not). At her young age now I say THROW_THROW_THROW]!
As she gains experience (knowing outs/runners on base/score/inning...yadayada) and develops a sence of expectation her aggresive nature will become a killer instict. A quick release is needed more so than arm strenght. Ideally the catchers feet should be cheating towards your "half skateboard" approach before the pitch is thrown.
Also at 10u level the centerfielder should know shes backing up the play. The whole infield should have "no fear" of missing an errant throw. A consistantly aggresive defense will make any offense think twice.

 

[absdad]

A consistantly aggresive defense will make any offense think twice.

I totally agree. It only takes a few attempts early on in the game, to set the tone. If the defense is not aggressive, the offense will be aggressive on the bases.

 

[Wookie]

Thanks for the responses - they all seem to agree with my opinion of what DD, and the other catchers, should be doing. I agree that if a steal is on that a bobble lowers the odds of getting the runner out, but I also agree that the catchers still need to try to get it there, since at some point they will have to do this.

Someone said it would give the other team the green light. Well, that's exactly what happened and it got to the point that the catcher wasn't even looking at the runners since they were told not to throw. And as you can imagine, they took off on the throw back to the pitcher. DD was devastated since she thought it was her fault and that she did a bad job. I told her that she did the job she was told to do. And as someone stated, they will be afraid to throw in the future, and that happened as well, even though they were being yelled at to throw it.

I'm also glad to hear that many of you have the opinion that I do that these coaches really do not know what they are doing. So the next question is, how should I handle this with the coaches?

 

[SnocatzDad]

I have a tendency to "awfulize" situations, but I'm trying to be more generous. Have a private discussion with the coach. Explain your opinion without tossing in "and that's what the experts say" see if you can bring him around. If not, you may have to suck it up and make it through this season, but be more selective about your team choice next year. If this Rec ball and you had an opportunity to coach yourself and turned it down not knowing what quality of coach you were sending you kid to, then your reaping what you sowed. Even if the coach is wrong, short of what he is asking being dangerous or unethical I think you should respect the coach enough to do what he asks while playing for him.