Bat Speed vs. Exit Speed?

[Westwind]

folks should really explore and understand number 2. The faster the bat speed is... the shorter time it’s in the hitting zone right? The shorter time it’s on plane with the pitch?

of course we want ‘fast enough’. Law of diminishing returns plays in everything.

Yes to this. I think the conventional wisdom of timing is to never slow your bat for a slower pitch etc. but there must “have to be” some adjustment in swing speed to square up balls?

 

[Westwind]

So here is my next thought: What good is data if you don’t have a way to make the hitter better in a practical way?

We started using Blast Motion again in mid April. It was due to team requirements and I kind of went along with it grudgingly.

Yet I noticed that the metrics she was “yellow” in were really affected by certain drills and using my latest purchase: Trey Hannams’ “Half Bat”

This was supposed to be dd’s senior year. She has never hit better and was set to cap off three really nice seasons with a barn burner of a year. So things were already going good.

But... when I put the sensor on the half bat and saw her plane score go from Yellow to green and to a lesser extent her bat speed go from 60’s to low 70’s on front toss I knew that was worth doing. (I didn’t put a lot of emphasis on the bat speed because she swings a 25 oz bat). I also noticed that one drill we had not done in awhile really boosted her plane score. So we did that more

Here is what happened in a short amount of time- her plane improved. Her game bat bat speed went up. Her rotational acceleration and hand speed went from top of the metrics to beyond the high range.

I’m a rank amateur. I was a Blast Motion denyer lol. But I think now that I’m starting to get some idea how to use this thing it can take players off a plateau and to the next step.

 

[radness]

Correct contact with the ball is essential for better exit speed.

In other words
Swinging the bat faster with lousy contact does not produce greater impact results.

Someone commented about the bats posibly assisting results.

I took an old white debeer ball.
And a new college yellow ball.
My old aluminum bat and a DeMarini.
Stood at home plate and tossed the ball up for myself to hit it.

Fence was 215'
Difference between the bats was almost irrelevant except for the DeMarini was much lighter. Possibly the aluminum bat may have had more impact punch because it was heavier but then again took more muscle. (didnt measure swing speed )
But the flight of the old debeer white ball with both bats was very similar.

*The yellow ball however flew much further and with either bat made it over the fence.
Easily flew 60' to 80' feet farther with each bat.
Old white ball hard to reach the fence.
New yellow ball flew over like a bird.

IMO the yellow ball which is created to have more flight is the greater advantage to hitters.
Eventhough the bats are lighter and may produce ability to swing faster.

With my understanding of hitting and calling pitches.
Miss hits are rarely as good.
Solid contact produces power.
As we know pitchers goal is to get the batter to miss or not make good contact.

Focus on solid contact hitting the ball.
The exit speed will be apparent with the naked eye!!

 

[radness]

So here is my next thought: What good is data if you don’t have a way to make the hitter better in a practical way?

We started using Blast Motion again in mid April. It was due to team requirements and I kind of went along with it grudgingly.

Yet I noticed that the metrics she was “yellow” in were really affected by certain drills and using my latest purchase: Trey Hannams’ “Half Bat”

This was supposed to be dd’s senior year. She has never hit better and was set to cap off three really nice seasons with a barn burner of a year. So things were already going good.

But... when I put the sensor on the half bat and saw her plane score go from Yellow to green and to a lesser extent her bat speed go from 60’s to low 70’s on front toss I knew that was worth doing. (I didn’t put a lot of emphasis on the bat speed because she swings a 25 oz bat). I also noticed that one drill we had not done in awhile really boosted her plane score. So we did that more

Here is what happened in a short amount of time- her plane improved. Her game bat bat speed went up. Her rotational acceleration and hand speed went from top of the metrics to beyond the high range.

I’m a rank amateur. I was a Blast Motion denyer lol. But I think now that I’m starting to get some idea how to use this thing it can take players off a plateau and to the next step.

Nice to read your detail.
You mention her swing plane improved.
Without seeing how exactly...
Would equate that to better impact!

Could you see visually the ball exiting faster/explosive?

Did you also notice a better trajectory of the ball? Its path?
More consistancy?

 

[BigSkyHi]

Correct contact with the ball is essential for better exit speed.

In other words
Swinging the bat faster with lousy contact does not produce greater impact results.

Someone commented about the bats posibly assisting results.

I took an old white debeer ball.
And a new college yellow ball.
My old aluminum bat and a DeMarini.
Stood at home plate and tossed the ball up for myself to hit it.

Fence was 215'
Difference between the bats was almost irrelevant except for the DeMarini was much lighter. Possibly the aluminum bat may have had more impact punch because it was heavier but then again took more muscle. (didnt measure swing speed )
But the flight of the old debeer white ball with both bats was very similar.

*The yellow ball however flew much further and with either bat made it over the fence.
Easily flew 60' to 80' feet farther with each bat.
Old white ball hard to reach the fence.
New yellow ball flew over like a bird.

IMO the yellow ball which is created to have more flight is the greater advantage to hitters.
Eventhough the bats are lighter and may produce ability to swing faster.

With my understanding of hitting and calling pitches.
Miss hits are rarely as good.
Solid contact produces power.
As we know pitchers goal is to get the batter to miss or not make good contact.

Focus on solid contact hitting the ball.
The exit speed will be apparent with the naked eye!!

Back in the earliest days of baseball, a curve was an illegal pitch because the pitcher was trying to fool the batter. My how times have changed.

Never have heard a pitching coach say goof up the hitter’s mechanics. It’s always:
Timing – change of speeds
Spatial – up/down and in/out

 

[Work=wins]

Yes to this. I think the conventional wisdom of timing is to never slow your bat for a slower pitch etc. but there must “have to be” some adjustment in swing speed to square up balls?

I think creating a longer arc to the ball is the way to adjust to a lesser speed pitch. Once the bat is launched, like say to a low and away curveball.

Not slowing down your swing, just making it longer with the body or arc of the swing. That’s a mechanics adjustment. Can’t have any leaks. Know what I mean. Hopefully I’m making sense.



comparison of arc.

 

[BigSkyHi]

I think creating a longer arc to the ball is the way to adjust to a lesser speed pitch. Once the bat is launched, like say to a low and away curveball.

Not slowing down your swing, just making it longer with the body or arc of the swing. That’s a mechanics adjustment. Can’t have any leaks. Know what I mean. Hopefully I’m making sense.

View attachment 17722

comparison of arc.

View attachment 17723

See a lot of players from the islands using the back foot in a manner similar to this for off speed and hitting to opposite field. Some also collapse back knee.

 

[radness]

Never have heard a pitching coach say goof up the hitter’s mechanics.

EXCELLENT POINT !!!

 

[Bobby Shirer]

When I saw your questions I decided to look back through all the college camp data that DD acquired throughout the years. What I noticed is that at each camp every single player's exit speed is lower than their bat speed. Not just a high percentage, but every one of them. All the articles I have seen on line claim that exit speed should be higher than bat speed. Obviously the quality of the impact will have a bearing on the exit speed. But I find it very unlikely that a camp with nearly 150 players with each measured 3 times would result in 450 mishits. Just doesn't seem possible. The only reason I can think of is ball density. In baseball, exit speed is typically much higher than bat speed. But a baseball is much harder than a softball. Perhaps the ball compression has an impact on the speed numbers... Need a physics expert to chime in

I'm not surprised by the numbers you are quoting for D1. You will find measurements all over the place... At one of the larger camps DD attended bat speed ratings ranged from upper 40's to low 70's. DD was upper 60's. Most of the exit speeds were 7 to 10 mph slower than the exit speeds. I'm not sure what type of equipment they were using at this event, but it showed higher speeds than DD gets from our Zepp sensor. She is typically mid-60's on that. Unfortunately the Zepp cannot measure exit speed.

NOTE: I will see if I can figure out a way to send you the info I'm looking at...

A new baseball's coefficient of return(cor)= 55. Bounce it off a hard surface and it will bounce back with 55% of the speed it collided with.
New NCAS softball COR=47.
Softball bat rebound limited to 1.20
Are the balls new? If not, the CORRECT is lower and the balls may have absorbed moisture so they're heavier.
Hit off a tee or pitched?
Angle of incidence plays a major part too.

 

[BigSkyHi]

A new baseball's coefficient of return(cor)= 55. Bounce it off a hard surface and it will bounce back with 55% of the speed it collided with.
New NCAS softball COR=47.
Softball bat rebound limited to 1.20
Are the balls new? If not, the CORRECT is lower and the balls may have absorbed moisture so they're heavier.
Hit off a tee or pitched?
Angle of incidence plays a major part too.

Could it be that men are so much stronger in the upper body than women?