Barnhill-Collegiate Player of the year. #usasoftball

[ArmyStrong]

FYI, no pitcher is being singled out.

https://www.discussfastpitch.com/college-softball-news-discussions/24142-ip-ucla.html

DFP is littered with a whole bunch of IP threads. Just need to do a search on the usual suspects.

 

[Softball scholar]

Hypothetical question,

So you have a 14 year old DD, with decent traditional mechanics. So you observe Kelly Barnhill, and she's killing it. No one is calling her for legal pitches. So you want an advantage for your DD, an decide to change her mechanics to mimic Barnhill. You work on that low leap ( back foot an inch off the ground) and slow the timing of the arm position, so you can get that second push off the plant foot. Yes its a project, but maybe you could increase her speed and get her closer to the plate. If somebody calls her for IP, you can say the NCAA player of the year and Olympic pitcher does it. To Riseball's chagrin, maybe the dad isn't even aware of the ethical question of illegal or not.

Would this be a mistake by dad to take this approach?

 

[Blacklabgator]

Blacklabgator what is your assessment of Barnhill's mechanics?

Different than most.


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[Blacklabgator]

Well it finally got serious when KenB chimes in. You don't usually see him on the high drama threads. Him, like most of us, enjoy a good "how do we get the right spin on the curve" conversation.

I also don't think it's OILF, although I thought of it myself for a minute. She wouldn't be defending a cheater like this, although she did love playing devils advocate and having a good argument. I think this is a relative or previous coach - who else would so adamantly defend something do indefensible??

Riseball thanks for taking the time and effort to argue for what is right. That is something that we don't have a lot of in our society anymore. There has definitely been a huge loss of absolutes and morals and it permeates every aspect of life. This whole conversation has made me think about what I might encourage my DD to do and it's reminded me that it's a game, a very important game, a game that makes people a lot of money, but you really have to be able to live with yourself and be proud of how you played the game and how you treated people, and what you've taught people. And I'm so grateful for my DD to have a coach like Ken who wouldn't encourage her to do all she can to cheat and get ahead at all costs.

Not a female. Not a previous coach and not a relative.
Just another poster on this board.


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[Blacklabgator]

[MENTION=9061]Classof2020[/MENTION] I would keep your avatar. This is a common tactic by [MENTION=7876]Rocketech1[/MENTION] where for whatever his motive tries to minimize the actions of Barnhill by comparing her with icons of the game. Do not fall for the smoke and mirrors. Comparing the illegal actions of Osterman with Barnhill is like comparing a jaywalker with a serial killer. From your post it sounds that with time your understanding of pitching mechanics has deepened. That said compare their mechanics side by side and come to your own conclusion. Which one happens to be illegal and which one is illegal by design? Which one attains a competitive advantage and which one does not? Like most true students of the game I expect you will come to the conclusion that Osterman who worked in the mid-60's and was a spinner just happened to be illegal from time to time and never attained a competitive advantage. Conversely I expect you will find that Barnhill who will hit 72mph and is a power pitcher is illegal by design and realizes a huge competitive advantage.

Of course [MENTION=7876]Rocketech1[/MENTION] will chime in that illegal is illegal which is true. But as you and most others know, this is not about IP's. It is about integrity. And when it comes to integrity, ones intent and deliberate actions are everything.

You keep acting as if barnhill is the only illegal pitcher that is "deliberate". So all the other get a pass because they aren't aware of what they are doing ?


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[riseball]

Hypothetical question,

So you have a 14 year old DD, with decent traditional mechanics. So you observe Kelly Barnhill, and she's killing it. No one is calling her for legal pitches. So you want an advantage for your DD, an decide to change her mechanics to mimic Barnhill. You work on that low leap ( back foot an inch off the ground) and slow the timing of the arm position, so you can get that second push off the plant foot. Yes its a project, but maybe you could increase her speed and get her closer to the plate. If somebody calls her for IP, you can say the NCAA player of the year and Olympic pitcher does it. To Riseball's chagrin, maybe the dad isn't even aware of the ethical question of illegal or not.

Would this be a mistake by dad to take this approach?

Do you believe that her mechanics are by design or perhaps she has overcome relatively poor mechanics with raw athletic ability?

 

[riseball]

You keep acting as if barnhill is the only illegal pitcher that is "deliberate". So all the other get a pass because they aren't aware of what they are doing ?


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Nothing further from the truth. Again, I refer you to the title of the thread. If Carlson, Silkwood, etc were the POY and pitching in the WCWS we would be having the same discussion. At this point the pitchers at home watching from their couch are irrelevant. .

 

[Softball scholar]

Do you believe that her mechanics are by design or perhaps she has overcome relatively poor mechanics with raw athletic ability?

I think she's overcome poor mechanics and she has great athletic ability. Do you know her pitching coach is? I wonder what the back story is there.

I was thinking what would happen If I told my DD to pick up the drag foot and then try to push off a second time with the plant foot. She would look at me like I was crazy and probably would look very silly in trying it. After 2 pitches of throwing it in the ground, or over the pitchers head she would say this is stupid and never do it again.

 

[GunnerShotgun]

I was thinking what would happen If I told my DD to pick up the drag foot and then try to push off a second time with the plant foot. She would look at me like I was crazy and probably would look very silly in trying it. After 2 pitches of throwing it in the ground, or over the pitchers head she would say this is stupid and never do it again.

An average 16u or 14u pitcher could pick up the movement in about 15 to 20 minutes. They could throw strikes but there would be no immediate increase in velocity. You would have to practice for a few weeks/months to see any gains in velocity (if any).

 

[riseball]

I think she's overcome poor mechanics and she has great athletic ability. Do you know her pitching coach is? I wonder what the back story is there.

I was thinking what would happen If I told my DD to pick up the drag foot and then try to push off a second time with the plant foot. She would look at me like I was crazy and probably would look very silly in trying it. After 2 pitches of throwing it in the ground, or over the pitchers head she would say this is stupid and never do it again.

So let's assume that the softball fairy waves her magic wand and poof the rules are the same as the men. Leap, Replant, No Lane, 1 Foot on Rubber. Assuming your DD is a RHP, which is now her stride foot and which is her pivot foot?