Arm Question

[Nor10]

Which arm is more important in a rotational swing? The back or the lead arm? How much of a role does that arm play in driving the ball at contact?

 

[straightleg]

IMHO
I would say work the front arm 80% of the time. The better you get at pulling the bat with the front arm the better bat leg you get and the more you take the push out of your swing.

Pulling with the front arm?

Is it the shoulder, Is it the arm, Is it the hand.

I tell them the elbow. Pull with the front elbow.


Elbows working in unison? Shoulders working in unison? What is powering the pull?

Like to hear what other people think on that.


Straightleg

 

[Mark H]

Unless pull with the elbow results in early elbow flexion.

 

[Hitter]

Unless pull with the elbow results in early elbow flexion.

Gerry before you ask this is the definition....In anatomy, flexion is a position that is made possible by the joint angle decreasing. The skeletal (bones, cartilage, and ligaments) and muscular (muscles and tendons) systems work together to move the joint into a "flexed" position. For example the elbow is flexed when the hand is brought closer to the shoulder. The trunk may be flexed toward the legs or the neck to the chest.

The opposite term is extension, or straightening. Flexion decreases the angle between the bones of the limb at a joint, and extension increases it.


Note that specific flexion activities may occur only along the sagittal plane, i.e. from the forward to backward direction, and not side-to-side direction, which is further discussed in abduction.

Thanks Howard

 

[straightleg]

Thanks Howard
I kinda understand the definition, but not how it relates to the swing.

I need things in simple terms. Just the way it is.



Straightleg

 

[Chris O'Leary]

Elbows working in unison? Shoulders working in unison? What is powering the pull?

Elbows, shoulders, and arms working in unison.

I agree that the front arm is the more important arm, but if the back arm wasn't there you'd end up barring the front arm.

The back arm has a role to play, but if it gets hyperactive you end up with disconnection and other problems.

 

[Mark H]

Thanks Howard
I kinda understand the definition, but not how it relates to the swing.

I need things in simple terms. Just the way it is.



Straightleg

If the cue results in some small degree of this over the top demonstration then pull with the elbow is a bad cue for that kid though of course it could be a good cue for another kid if it results in good connection. Photo 18 of 31, Analysis

If this is how the student inteprets pull with the elbow, great. Photo 15 of 31, Analysis

 

[Nor10]

Elbows, shoulders, and arms working in unison.

I agree that the front arm is the more important arm, but if the back arm wasn't there you'd end up barring the front arm.

The back arm has a role to play, but if it gets hyperactive you end up with disconnection and other problems.

So, at least 2 of you have said you think the lead arm is more important. Hitter and Mark, I am not sure where they stand, but I'll pose my question anyway.

My daughter is left handed and therefore stronger with her left arm, more coordinated with her left arm, etc. She sets up at home plate like a normal lefty does, however, I have to ask. Why then, if the lead arm is in fact more important for power and control of the bat during a swing, why do we have them bat from the side of the plate that puts that strong arm in the least important role?

I know I am focusing on one of many aspects of a swing, but I am curious your thoughts. I know the whole body has to work together, but it seems a lot of young hitters really struggle with their predominate arm getting in the way. I often wonder if you shouldn't teach young kids to hit opposite from where they normally would? Would you have more success doing that? Why does Ken Griffey, Jr bat lefty, or Prince Fielder, or Barry Bonds when they all are natural rightys? Is it just to be closer to 1st?

And no, I have no intention of making changes to my kids, I am just posing this question for discussion.

 

[Hitter]

So, at least 2 of you have said you think the lead arm is more important. Hitter and Mark, I am not sure where they stand, but I'll pose my question anyway.

My daughter is left handed and therefore stronger with her left arm, more coordinated with her left arm, etc. She sets up at home plate like a normal lefty does, however, I have to ask. Why then, if the lead arm is in fact more important for power and control of the bat during a swing, why do we have them bat from the side of the plate that puts that strong arm in the least important role?

I know I am focusing on one of many aspects of a swing, but I am curious your thoughts. I know the whole body has to work together, but it seems a lot of young hitters really struggle with their predominate arm getting in the way. I often wonder if you shouldn't teach young kids to hit opposite from where they normally would? Would you have more success doing that? Why does Ken Griffey, Jr bat lefty, or Prince Fielder, or Barry Bonds when they all are natural rightys? Is it just to be closer to 1st?

And no, I have no intention of making changes to my kids, I am just posing this question for discussion.

I copied this from the net as I thought it was interesting.... Conclusions

I guess we can sum things up this way: left-handed batters have a definite advantage over right handers. If Albert Pujols woke up one day miraculously transformed into a left-hander, he would very likely be a better hitter than he already is. This has nothing to do with being closer to first base when he bats, but is rather a consequence of the fact that he'd face a lot more opposite-hand pitching as a lefty. (There could be other reasons, too: I have not looked at the effect of defensive positioning, e.g. holding a runner on at first base, on left- and right-handed hitters.)

However, the seven-point difference in batting average between lefties and righties, or most of it anyway, exists only because of the positional bias. If not for that effect, the supply of replacement players would even out the L/R difference among major league batters.

My own thoughts....I feel the lead arm plays a major role in the swing and more so in females as to neuro muscular skills or a lack there of. It has been my experience that a major improvement in a short period of time can tale place when the hitter understands the grip first, extension and connection.

The grip we use has been described in a previous thread so I will not go over it again only to say many of the girls keep the bat in the back of their top hand and restrict the movement and roll the wrist. At contact they give up on driving the ball and you see the lead arm fold over/ bend and the finish against the shoulder or dump it straight over and slap their back.

Extension is new too many females and the hand over drill has been used very well to get an almost instant feed back of what we want them to do. We just did this at a clinic in Columbus Ohio especially with the wrist rollers once we demonstrated how to use the hammer and how to grip the bat keeping the thumb from holding down the index finger and keeping the bat out of the back of the hand.

The rope being held then puts the feeling in the hitters hands of what bag lag is and that working both hands, elbows and shoulders feel like to the hitters. Combine these elements and we have found it is easier to teach see it, feel it and fix it.

Colerain High School went to the final four in softball last year for the first time in their schools history. We converted four right handed kids to left handed. Catlin Lowe was in town so we had them come up and work with her and then I took the hitting over and their contribution to the team was incredible. We made legitimate hitters out of them first and then slappers second as I feel they must rotate as needed to hit and to slap so it goes hand in hand.

Normally the right handed persons right arm is larger than the left in diameter so it may be dominate as too strength however unless the grip is correct it can also serve to restrict the bat movement. Extension and connection and that feeling can be taught in our opinion.

Peter Graves was a one handed hitter in the forties I think during the war years and I may have his name incorrect as it could have been Gray, however he could only hit the ball about 180 feet. I do not think barring the arm out is as much of an issue if you teach rotating as needed and how the lead elbow goes forward and up like it is going up a ramp.

Thanks Howard

 

[Nor10]

I was mistaken. Griffey is a natural lefty apparently. Thanks for the talking points Hitter. It gives me something to think about.