Adding to the roster

[Alsmygal]

Maybe I'm overreacting, but some outside opinions would be appreciated. DD plays on a 12u team. They had try outs the first of August and were told the team would be finalized by August 12. They've been practicing hard two to three times each week for a month now and they just won their first tournament this last weekend. DD is one of three good pitchers on the team. One pitcher is a little better than the other two as far as keeping the ball on the corners and keeping the batters' timing off. The other two are pretty much even with each other. They all play on a fairly even rotation. The team's roster has 12 players on it.

An outfielder's dad mentioned to the coach that a friend of his has a daughter that used to play with his daughter and is looking for a new team this fall. He said she's a good pitcher and would like to try out. Coach went ahead and had the girl come to work out with the team tonight and welcomed her to the team with open arms. I didn't get to see the girl pitch. Maybe she is the next Jenny Finch....who knows? The thing that irritates me is that the team was supposed to be finalized a month ago. Tryouts were supposed to have been overwith a month ago.

If a coach's roster is full and he's got three good pitchers, then why would he go and look to add a fourth pitcher to the rotation? I think it would be hard to try to field a roster of 13, personally. What do you think?

 

[Scl1991]

I think that situation stinks. I get where your anxiety is coming from and your worry. First and foremost it could be cutting into your daughter's playing time. I also understand that you feel like the coach didn't keep up his end of the bargain. I wonder if this new player played another position, for example outfield, that your daughter does that, would it bother you quite so much? Probably not. And that's okay because it probably wouldn't bother me as much either
Unfortunately this is just one of those sucky situations. Your daughter does not get paid to play, you pay for her to play. Especially if the 12U level. But we play travel ball for over eight years, and if there's one thing I learned it's that travel ball coaches are always looking for good players and they will rarely turn them down especially if it's a pitcher. I don't know if teams can ever really have enough pitchers. You can try to talk to the coach about how you feel, but I'm not sure that that will resolve anything. I doubt he will turn away the new player. You can leave the team if it really bothers you that much but I don't know that you will always find a better situation anywhere else. What I learned during our years of travel ball was that no situation is ever perfect and you learn to find what you can deal with and what you can't and then stick with the teams that make you the happiest for the most part.
The coach should've done what he said he was going to do and end tryouts. That's just part of being professional.

 

[Alsmygal]

You're right. It probably wouldn't bother me quite as much if this new girl played another position. The team has a weak outfield and a couple of very weak spots on the infield. I don't know what other positions she may be able to help out at. I just know that it is hard to keep everyone happy when you've got 13 on the roster. Plus, the one position the team is very strong at is pitching. All three of the original pitchers could be a starter on a number of teams.

 

[vdubya]

Um, 12U isn't HS.

Als,
Carrying four pitchers isn't necessarily the problem, especially if the OF and some of the IF is weak. Thirteen players on a 12u roster is the problem. Inexperienced coaches try it (and this sounds like a relatively inexperienced coach), and they end up with issues...unhappy players, unhappy parents, and poor team chemistry.

When you see a 12u team at a tournament and there are four players on the bench, that means that there are eight players...yes, EIGHT who aren't real happy with their situation. EIGHT sets of parents have daughters who play half-time, +/- and they all wonder why they paid for this situation, why they gave up their weekend for it.

Let's be real here...a coach who is inexperienced enough to roster 13 players probably is a guy with a DD on the team. She and the asst coaches DD's will all be playing every out, full-time...because of their superior talent blah blah which just might be the case. These coaches want their own kids and the team to look good and win trophies, so the very best couple of kids on the team will also play full-time with the coaching staffs daughters. SOOO, when you add the top 2 players plus the coaches daughters, that accounts for what the coach considers the "core" of the team. This "core" is what he thinks are the five "studs." They simply MUST be in the game, always. Follow me here...

Along with the teams five thoroughbreds, the coach has to round out the outfield, lol, and decide which four girls on the roster will fill out the starting nine positions. Fine, four players will have to sit the bench and his decision was probably easy, or at least painless because it didn't involve any of his studs. By the way, if the coach only had another 3-4 "studs" with the talent level of his "core" then he would set the world on fire...maybe next year. He'll keep his eye out in case another ringor comes along. But I digress. Back to the four who get to round out the team and bat in the 6,7,8,9 slots respectively...

When it comes time to put the 'scrubs' in, I mean the 'subs', because this wise coach knows he needs to sprinkle in the frowning girls from the bench (FOUR of them remember?). After all, most of their parents are whispering things to each other under their breath and some have moved their chairs down the right field line away from the stud/core parents for reasons that no one can figure out. It will all be good if this savvy coach can get those subs in for the last couple of innings.

Guess who comes out when the subs go in...the SAME four girls who always come out of the game...the "non-cores"...the 6,7,8,9 although probably not all at the same time. It happens time and again and eventually everyone on the team figures out that there are five players and eight subs. Yes, four of the starters are on the sub in/out rotation and are playing half-time. Another four from the bench are half-timers. That makes eight.

The point here is that at the young age of 12u, kids need to play. Period. Paying parents need to see their kid play. Full-time PAY for half-time PLAY doesn't cut it. Whether sooner or later, the eight parents start to realize that they are subsidizing the costs of the "core" who play full-time. They all get disgruntled to some degree and their is no chemistry left except bad chemistry, probably with resentment.

Eventually the coach will learn to roster fewer girls at 12u. Is twelve too many? Ummm...multiply the number who sit the bench in any given inning by two and that means SIX are unhappy with a 12 player roster. Half of the team...better go with ten or eleven for the happiness of all. With only 1-2 subs, it is easier for a coach to rotate and share playing time among the entire team, while still keeping a high percentage of his little difference-makers on the field in any given inning.

I ramble, but roster size alone has sooo much to do with making the experience a positive one. Why is it that so many teams advertise year after year..."We have a great core of players looking for a few key players to round out the team". Now you know why. Everyone but the core left at the end of the year...again.

I am not saying that this is the case for you Als, just sharing what is generally the case when young teams roster too many. Players, families, and yes even the coaches eventually figure out that too many is too many!

 

[vdubya]

The other side of the coin from the eyes of the stud/core parents:

In the event that the coach tries to keep the 'bottom eight' on his roster of 13 happy, say by batting the lineup/free substitution, etc, then eventually the "core" starts to become disenfranchised. They want to win games and they can't do that playing 'keep-everybody-happy-ball' with thirteen on the roster.

Thirteen doesn't work for 12u.

Good luck all!

 

[CoogansBluff]

Most every 12U coach that I know will give lip service to the idea that their main goal is to develop kids, or that they're in it for the girls, etc. Well, how do you know if this is true?

Red flags that coaches are in it for winning, or for themselves, or for their daughters --

They will have rosters that are too big (more than 12 is good starting point)
They will add players when they already have enough.
They will make unnecessary roster additions after a full team has played tournaments and begun to bond.
They will eliminate weaker players during the season by not giving them playing time.
They will use pickup players when they aren't necessary.
They will not clearly communicate their plan/philosophy for the roster and playing time before the season, or they will communicate it but not stick to it.
They will rationalize keeping players on the bench by saying they want 'team players' and that they are teaching them life's lessons.
They become easily and visibly frustrated at their players and lack patience.
They fake being nice and friendly and upbeat with players at the start of the season but their true selves come out as the season wears on.
Their body language and intensity during games is much higher than that of the players.

 

[Alsmygal]

Sounds like some of you think like I do. In the coach's defense, he doesn't have a daughter on the team, nor is he related to anyone on the team. I think he is genuinely trying to build softball players and has expanded his club from 14u, 16u, and 18u teams to now include a 10u and a 12u. It is a brand new team with several girls that have never played competitive softball. I'm really not worried about my own DD's playing time because she's a very good pitcher and a strong infielder who can also play in the outfield if needed. Maybe she would be considered one of the "core" players. I just don't think it's necessary to keep adding to the roster. My DD already played on a team where it was not easy to field three pitchers, and now I just think the coach may be opening a can of worms by adding a fourth pitcher into the mix. I still don't know what other position this new pitcher might play when she's not on the mound, so who knows what other parent/parents will be upset when their dd's could possibly lose playing time. Like I said, it's just frustrating to see the roster continue to grow when we were originally told there would be 11 players on this 12u team.