FFS, I'm not familiar with the "spine engine." Can you, or someone, explain this to me or point me to a thread where it's discussed? I'd like to be able to tell my dd what it is/how it feels, and how to use it in her swing. Thanks.
12 Yr Old DD Swing - What Needs Work?
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FFS, I'm not familiar with the "spine engine." Can you, or someone, explain this to me or point me to a thread where it's discussed? I'd like to be able to tell my dd what it is/how it feels, and how to use it in her swing. Thanks.
FiveFrameSwing
Banned
Rumble25 … try it out yourself before giving it to your daughter to work with.
First, there is some decent information on it … but let me attempt to dumb it down into something short and sweet.
Do you recall JBooth writing about lateral tilt and how the lower spine bends at the L3/L4 point?
Well, instead of thinking “hips” and “hands” … think in terms of “tilt the spine at the L3/L4 point” and “throw the barrel” … think “bend and throw” … where the ‘bend’ is the bending of the spine at the L3/L4 point in the direction that would give you ‘lateral tilt’. The titling of the spine, at the lower portion of the spine, will have you using your upper rear leg to drive/power your swing … it will have the “hips leading the shoulders” in a sense of rotation towards contact. It will basically result in what many refer to as driving with the hips … but with ‘resisting hips’ (I’ll throw that in there for a certain crowd) … and for some it is another way of automating the “hips & hands” mentality in a powerful way.
First, there is some decent information on it … but let me attempt to dumb it down into something short and sweet.
Do you recall JBooth writing about lateral tilt and how the lower spine bends at the L3/L4 point?
Well, instead of thinking “hips” and “hands” … think in terms of “tilt the spine at the L3/L4 point” and “throw the barrel” … think “bend and throw” … where the ‘bend’ is the bending of the spine at the L3/L4 point in the direction that would give you ‘lateral tilt’. The titling of the spine, at the lower portion of the spine, will have you using your upper rear leg to drive/power your swing … it will have the “hips leading the shoulders” in a sense of rotation towards contact. It will basically result in what many refer to as driving with the hips … but with ‘resisting hips’ (I’ll throw that in there for a certain crowd) … and for some it is another way of automating the “hips & hands” mentality in a powerful way.
FFS, I've been working on my swing and I have to tell ya, getting old stinks! My back is killing me
I'd like to see if I have the order of events correct. What I've been doing is using "the move" to get what I believe you call "forward by coiling", which allows me to keep my coil through the stride, storing the potential energy in my upper thigh. When I get to toe-touch, this is when I've been bending at the L3/L4 of the spine--this small movement has BIG results. I notice that when I'm bending at the L3/L4, my front heel comes down, my back heel begins to come up, my knee automatically moves in and down, and my back hip/thigh begin to come forward separating my lower and upper halves without pulling my front shoulder out. I realize my front and back heel may not be governed by the tilt, just saying that what happens when I do it. Don't know if I'm correctly explaining everything that I think I'm feeling/seeing. After that, my backside powers the hips and my hands are pulled into action ready to throw the barrel, or at least that's what it feels like.
So I guess what I'm doing, to put it simply is:
1. Forward by coiling (the move)
2. Stretch [bend at L3/L4] and Fire
3. Throw the barrel
Am I bending at the L3/L4 at the correct time? Thanks for the help.
Let's start with "the move".
1) Step into the batter's box with the rear foot. In doing so have the bulk of the pressure on the rear foot on the inside 'ball' of the rear foot. That will help serve as a reminder that the ball of the rear foot will serve as a sort of pivot point.
2) Step into the batter's box with the front foot. Be 'balanced' statically. No rearward lean. Have the quads and hamstrings 'dynamically' balanced ... that is the legs are bent, and the quads & hams are opposing each other ... they are 'balanced' in opposition ... they are 'dynamically balanced' ... they are activated. The upper body will have a slight lean forward ... just enough to 'activate' the upper torso.
3) Using the muscles in the rear upper leg ... cock the rear hip. This may feel like the rear leg is being twisted. Being a right handed hitter, your daughter should feel a pressure that travels down to the rear foot which will give her the feel that the rear foot "wants" to turn "clockwise" ... but it is resisted from turning clockwise because of friction between her cleat & the ground. Feel that "clockwise" pressure. Don't go any further until you feel that "clockwise" pressure as if the "inside" portion of the rear foot has a pressure between it and the ground, that would have the rear foot turning "clockwise". You need to "feel" that if we are going to proceed.
4) Continue to coil. To do this your daughter may recruit her frontside. She may turn her front knee inward. She may internally rotate her front foot. She may/should bend more at the waist (anterior tilt), which will assist the coil and load the lower back muscles for the upcoming rotation that is to take place. During this time, feel the continued "pressure" between the "ground" and the "rear foot". There is a build-up in pressure trying to turn it "clockwise" ... but because of the resistance the foot will remain planted ... yet the pressure build-up will continue. As you continue to coil, the pressure by the rear foot will become more active, and will push ... a push as in adding pressure that would turn the foot "clockwise", but because the rear foot is restricted from moving ... AND because the coiling action is still occurring, the body will move forward ... this is the 'stride' ... we refer to this as "forward by coiling". There is a "dynamic balance" established between the "coiling" taking place and the "clockwise" pressure at the rear foot resisting/opposing that coil.
5) As the front foot moves to foot plant the "rear leg" will "uncoil" ... that is it will "untwist". The pressure at the back foot will continue to be a "clockwise" pressure. The "feel" from a hitter's perspective is that the "clockwise" pressure will continue to be exerted in a "clockwise" direction until "contact", although in reality it is only until rear foot eversion.
6) In terms of the lower body, have the mindset of the "rear leg" being in charge. It's "coil" and "uncoil". Simply allow the front leg to catch the body. Take whatever stride "results" from the "coil" ... that is, do not force a particular stride and do not purposely stride linearly so as to bypass the 'coil' & 'uncoil' action of the rear leg.
What I would like your daughter to do is work on "coil" and "uncoil" ... starting the action with the muscles in the upper rear leg ... feel the "rear leg" twisting/coiling and feel the build up of "clockwise" pressure at the rear foot. Allow a slow and fluid 'coil' to allow the build-up of that "clockwise" pressure and maintain a "clockwise" pressure at the rear foot during the "uncoiling" of the "rear leg". Keep that "clockwise" pressure sensation of the rear foot until the rear hip pulls the rear foot forward off the ground. Do this ... and the bug squish will be gone ... and your daughter will be on her way to building a lower body that is worth "connecting" to.
Keep working on 'coil' and 'uncoil'. Use the 2:1 ratio. Get to the point where the bug squishing is long gone and the "feel" is that of a slow & fluid gathering of energy to explode/uncoil.
I hope FFS doesn't mind me reposting this for him? This was posted at Megan1-tee started by Immortal1.I hope it helps explain better.
1) Step into the batter's box with the rear foot. In doing so have the bulk of the pressure on the rear foot on the inside 'ball' of the rear foot. That will help serve as a reminder that the ball of the rear foot will serve as a sort of pivot point.
2) Step into the batter's box with the front foot. Be 'balanced' statically. No rearward lean. Have the quads and hamstrings 'dynamically' balanced ... that is the legs are bent, and the quads & hams are opposing each other ... they are 'balanced' in opposition ... they are 'dynamically balanced' ... they are activated. The upper body will have a slight lean forward ... just enough to 'activate' the upper torso.
3) Using the muscles in the rear upper leg ... cock the rear hip. This may feel like the rear leg is being twisted. Being a right handed hitter, your daughter should feel a pressure that travels down to the rear foot which will give her the feel that the rear foot "wants" to turn "clockwise" ... but it is resisted from turning clockwise because of friction between her cleat & the ground. Feel that "clockwise" pressure. Don't go any further until you feel that "clockwise" pressure as if the "inside" portion of the rear foot has a pressure between it and the ground, that would have the rear foot turning "clockwise". You need to "feel" that if we are going to proceed.
4) Continue to coil. To do this your daughter may recruit her frontside. She may turn her front knee inward. She may internally rotate her front foot. She may/should bend more at the waist (anterior tilt), which will assist the coil and load the lower back muscles for the upcoming rotation that is to take place. During this time, feel the continued "pressure" between the "ground" and the "rear foot". There is a build-up in pressure trying to turn it "clockwise" ... but because of the resistance the foot will remain planted ... yet the pressure build-up will continue. As you continue to coil, the pressure by the rear foot will become more active, and will push ... a push as in adding pressure that would turn the foot "clockwise", but because the rear foot is restricted from moving ... AND because the coiling action is still occurring, the body will move forward ... this is the 'stride' ... we refer to this as "forward by coiling". There is a "dynamic balance" established between the "coiling" taking place and the "clockwise" pressure at the rear foot resisting/opposing that coil.
5) As the front foot moves to foot plant the "rear leg" will "uncoil" ... that is it will "untwist". The pressure at the back foot will continue to be a "clockwise" pressure. The "feel" from a hitter's perspective is that the "clockwise" pressure will continue to be exerted in a "clockwise" direction until "contact", although in reality it is only until rear foot eversion.
6) In terms of the lower body, have the mindset of the "rear leg" being in charge. It's "coil" and "uncoil". Simply allow the front leg to catch the body. Take whatever stride "results" from the "coil" ... that is, do not force a particular stride and do not purposely stride linearly so as to bypass the 'coil' & 'uncoil' action of the rear leg.
What I would like your daughter to do is work on "coil" and "uncoil" ... starting the action with the muscles in the upper rear leg ... feel the "rear leg" twisting/coiling and feel the build up of "clockwise" pressure at the rear foot. Allow a slow and fluid 'coil' to allow the build-up of that "clockwise" pressure and maintain a "clockwise" pressure at the rear foot during the "uncoiling" of the "rear leg". Keep that "clockwise" pressure sensation of the rear foot until the rear hip pulls the rear foot forward off the ground. Do this ... and the bug squish will be gone ... and your daughter will be on her way to building a lower body that is worth "connecting" to.
Keep working on 'coil' and 'uncoil'. Use the 2:1 ratio. Get to the point where the bug squishing is long gone and the "feel" is that of a slow & fluid gathering of energy to explode/uncoil.
I hope FFS doesn't mind me reposting this for him? This was posted at Megan1-tee started by Immortal1.I hope it helps explain better.
FFS, I've been working on my swing and I have to tell ya, getting old stinks! My back is killing me
I'd like to see if I have the order of events correct. What I've been doing is using "the move" to get what I believe you call "forward by coiling", which allows me to keep my coil through the stride, storing the potential energy in my upper thigh. When I get to toe-touch, this is when I've been bending at the L3/L4 of the spine--this small movement has BIG results. I notice that when I'm bending at the L3/L4, my front heel comes down, my back heel begins to come up, my knee automatically moves in and down, and my back hip/thigh begin to come forward separating my lower and upper halves without pulling my front shoulder out. I realize my front and back heel may not be governed by the tilt, just saying that what happens when I do it. Don't know if I'm correctly explaining everything that I think I'm feeling/seeing. After that, my backside powers the hips and my hands are pulled into action ready to throw the barrel, or at least that's what it feels like.
So I guess what I'm doing, to put it simply is:
1. Forward by coiling (the move)
2. Stretch [bend at L3/L4] and Fire
3. Throw the barrel
Am I bending at the L3/L4 at the correct time? Thanks for the help.
Actually, I think I said L2/L3, but it isn't that critical, you can't choose which spot to bend.
Also, I don't think it is something you have to think about much, or teach. The bend in the spine occurs as a result of trying to maintain some tilt toward the plate as the torso rotates in two pieces. Bottom, then top.
FiveFrameSwing
Banned
FFS, I've been working on my swing and I have to tell ya, getting old stinks! My back is killing me
I'd like to see if I have the order of events correct. What I've been doing is using "the move" to get what I believe you call "forward by coiling", which allows me to keep my coil through the stride, storing the potential energy in my upper thigh. When I get to toe-touch, this is when I've been bending at the L3/L4 of the spine--this small movement has BIG results. I notice that when I'm bending at the L3/L4, my front heel comes down, my back heel begins to come up, my knee automatically moves in and down, and my back hip/thigh begin to come forward separating my lower and upper halves without pulling my front shoulder out. I realize my front and back heel may not be governed by the tilt, just saying that what happens when I do it. Don't know if I'm correctly explaining everything that I think I'm feeling/seeing. After that, my backside powers the hips and my hands are pulled into action ready to throw the barrel, or at least that's what it feels like.
So I guess what I'm doing, to put it simply is:
1. Forward by coiling (the move)
2. Stretch [bend at L3/L4] and Fire
3. Throw the barrel
Am I bending at the L3/L4 at the correct time? Thanks for the help.
Pretty decent description Rumble25. There is an overlap with the use of the backside to turn the barrel ... many feel this in their hands. While the bending may feel to you that it starts off independently, the degree of bend will be a function of using your backside to turn the barrel.
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