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Thread: What is weight shift?

  1. #91
    Certified softball maniac corlay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pattar View Post
    If your DD's swing looks like Roberto Clemente's I would say leave her alone
    Ha! point taken...

    But what i was trying to get at is,
    If the batter literally drives her hands rearward during FBC (like Clemente)
    I think it puts the body in a weak position to turn the barrel, rearward behind the body.
    Do you agree?

    Further point is, I guess, that teaching "separation" in the sequence can be taken too far?

    Common credo is "stride away from the hands".
    Meaning the hands don't drift forward with the body during FBC,
    but should they be driven rearward in space, to maximize "separation"?
    I'm not so sure about that...

  2. #92
    I can talk softball all day BadMonkeys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corlay View Post
    Question on this gif:
    If the batter's separation at FBC (max load at toe touch) is this great,
    with lead arm extended so far rearward,
    can you still turn the barrel effectively? and not have a bat drag type swing?

    I ask, because this looks a bit like my 14U DD;
    and I'm just getting ready to drill this out of her a bit.
    With arms/hands extended so far rearward,
    it just doesn't seem like turning the barrel at swing initiation (vs. dropping barrel and dragging bat forward)
    would be very natural.

    Advice? Clarification?

    Thank you.
    I'm thinking if it's being turned it's not being dragged. And I think I understand one of the goals is early bat speed, early, behind the body, behind the turning rear leg.?
    Last edited by BadMonkeys; 11-13-2017 at 04:56 PM.

  3. #93
    Softball Junkie pattar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corlay View Post
    Ha! point taken...

    But what i was trying to get at is,
    If the batter literally drives her hands rearward during FBC (like Clemente)
    I think it puts the body in a weak position to turn the barrel, rearward behind the body.
    Do you agree?

    Further point is, I guess, that teaching "separation" in the sequence can be taken too far?

    Common credo is "stride away from the hands".
    Meaning the hands don't drift forward with the body during FBC,
    but should they be driven rearward in space, to maximize "separation"?
    I'm not so sure about that...
    I don't think it is necessarily bad as long as the hand movement is sequenced correctly, i.e she takes them back as she is striding forward.
    Halfway down this page:

    https://baseballdebate.proboards.com/...tretch?page=49

    Look at the before and after gifs of the top hitter. Read the discussion that goes along with it as the instructor (mudvine) talks a bit about
    the changes made.
    Last edited by pattar; 11-13-2017 at 05:05 PM.

  4. #94
    Certified softball maniac corlay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pattar View Post
    Look at the before and after gifs of the top hitter. Read the discussion that goes along with it as the instructor (mudvine) talks a bit about
    the changes made.
    thanks for the link, but i do not have access

  5. #95
    Softball Junkie pattar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corlay View Post
    thanks for the link, but i do not have access
    Sorry..I tried to post the vids on here but it kept changing the links to https and then
    the page wouldn't load. The two links to the gifs are
    Before:
    https://i56.tinypic.com/et8bwz.jpg

    After:
    https://i51.tinypic.com/50sdpg.jpg

    To get them to load change the https to http

    Basically my interpretation of the handset change and rearward movement of the hands in the after was the hitter self-adjusting this portion
    of the swing to other things which mudvine was trying to get him to do.

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    Softball Junkie Shawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corlay View Post
    Ha! point taken...

    But what i was trying to get at is,
    If the batter literally drives her hands rearward during FBC (like Clemente)
    I think it puts the body in a weak position to turn the barrel, rearward behind the body.
    Do you agree?
    The hands can be turned the same way as someone who has the hands closer to their body. For example they have broad shoulders and the lead arm is extended across their chest in-which this naturally places the hands close to their body. They may look different but the same thing is happening.

    Further point is, I guess, that teaching "separation" in the sequence can be taken too far?

    Common credo is "stride away from the hands".
    Meaning the hands don't drift forward with the body during FBC,
    but should they be driven rearward in space, to maximize "separation"?
    I'm not so sure about that...
    That is just one aspect of separation. The hands staying back as the stride goes forward or walking away from the hands. Another aspect of separation is the hips leading the swing.
    Last edited by Shawn; 11-14-2017 at 08:07 PM.
    "It is hard to fill a cup that is already full"

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    It wasn't me. rdbass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corlay View Post
    Ha! point taken...

    But what i was trying to get at is,
    If the batter literally drives her hands rearward during FBC (like Clemente)
    I think it puts the body in a weak position to turn the barrel, rearward behind the body.
    Do you agree?
    'Drives her hands rearward'
    Not what I would like a hitter doing. I prefer 'walking away from the hands'. The body 'walks away' from the hands. The hands are 'held' in the same position as the body 'walks away'. The hands don't 'drive' rearward away from the body.
    In your description I picture 'arm barring'. I'm guessing.
    I don't know sh!t from shinola!

  8. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to rdbass For This Useful Post:

    corlay (11-14-2017), Shawn (11-14-2017)

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    Always learning... Eric F's Avatar
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    More thoughts on the "shift" and "transfer" topic...

    It seems like the general consensus at BBD is that "transfer" is associated with COM movement, and "shift" is associated with COP movement. In an effort to keep things more consistent in my own dumb brain, and for those who post/read in both places, it makes sense to be agreement with how those words are used by others describing the same actions. This also aligns with phrases like "shift and swing" and "the swing causes the shift" which is more about COP movement than COM movement. As I've said before, understanding the difference between COM movement and COP movement is more important than the labels they are given.
    Last edited by Eric F; 11-15-2017 at 06:33 PM.
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  10. #99
    Softball Junkie Shawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric F View Post
    More thoughts on the "shift" and "transfer" topic...

    It seems like the general consensus at BBD is that "transfer" is associated with COM movement, and "shift" is associated with COP movement. In an effort to keep things more consistent in my own dumb brain, and for those who post/read in both places, it makes sense to be agreement with how those words are used by others describing the same actions. This also aligns with phrases like "shift and swing" and "the swing causes the shift" which is more about COP movement than COM movement. As I've said before, understanding the difference between COM movement and COP movement is more important than the labels they are given.
    Wouldn't it be the other way around?
    "It is hard to fill a cup that is already full"

  11. #100
    I eat, sleep and breathe softball FiveFrameSwing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn View Post
    Wouldn't it be the other way around?
    The words 'shift' and 'transfer' are synonyms ... they mean the same thing.

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