coaches interfering with players

[obbay]

Thanks for the feedback- great info!
I should also state for the record one of my pet peeves is players swinging at the first pitch, popping up in the infield. I want them to be patient at the plate.
I don't know if I was clear or not, but these coaches are basically rec coaches- they have no qualifications. they just volunteered. Because they are the coaches, they feel that they are empowered to make these calls and give the players helpful tips (like telling a girl who's about to get up to bat to try to hit the lower half of the ball).

also DD was out for 4 months with a concussion, returning mid-June. she started out hitting strong for a couple games and then slipped into a slump (batting in the 300's rather than the 600's.) still not striking out but not hitting the ball as hard as she used to- seems to be all singles and few extra base hits.. I'm thinking the coaches think she needs their advice. some of their info may be correct for some players in certain circumstances, but they are applying one-size-fits-all. Partly because the head coach's DD is a good hitter who strikes out a lot and she gets more and more panicky the more strikes she has on her. so he is trying to undo what he thinks her problem is.

You say your daughter is a good two-strike hitter. That's great. But you're never as good a hitter w/ two strikes as with one strike or no strikes.

that sounds like it makes sense, but i don't think it applies in this case. she studies the pitcher and the deliveries and gets a good read so that when she swings she understands the pitch she's swinging at. She has a very good eye - more experienced coaches have commented on this in the past. working the count helps her get focused in to the product the pitcher is producing.

the talk about better pitchers and better contol doesn't apply to every team she faces and, in fact, when she does face those good pitchers, working the count seems to be more effective.

I agree wholeheartedly that later in the game she's already seen some pitches and then it would be the time to go for a first pitch that she likes.

at her last game, a couple of coaches were discussing working the count vs swinging at any pitch you think is a strike. during the discussion the team had 3 consecutive batters pop up the first pitch in the infield. I told the coach that with a little more discipline t the plate, we'd still be up. to which he responded "who wants to drag out an inning anyway..."

 

[softballphreak]

There are two issues here. The first is the soundness of the strategy to be aggressive on the first pitch. The other is how much freedom we give coaches to coach our daughters. Both are great questions.

IMO, if it's a question of strategy, it's the coach's call all the way. I might disagree w/ the strategy, but that's irrelevant. It's the coach's job to make those decisions, not mine. He is not interfering, but coaching.

Exactly right!

 

[DB1]

I think that they should be more specific. I like the girls to be looking for their specific pitch that they can drive. Not just any strike. Take a part of the zone that they hit well and look for their pitch in that zone. If it's there hit it hard. With three strikes, I wouldn't want them to just be hacking at a strike low and away that they really can't put a good swing on. I would take the chance that the pitcher may make a mistake and give the hitter something to hit.

 

[SoftSocDad]

BTW, Obbay, I'm really glad your daughter has made it back to the game. How is everything else going for her? Wasn't she doing other sports, too?

 

[obbay]

Thanks SSD! she's kind of drifting away from figure skating but plans to resume hockey in the winter. She also started playing Volleyball this fall.
She seems to be recovered but something is still not right so she started seeing a therapist last week. She gets overwhelmed way too easily. she is learning to drive and after half a dozen lessons with the instructor she is not any better at driving a car and she is more afraid. I'm very interested to see how her grades will be this semester.
you know how girls change as they grow up, the concussion came at an interesting time in that it derailed everything.

Music seemed to come back pretty quickly. Softball seemed to come back at first where she went 3 for 3 her first 2 games back and hit a homerun in each game. She has played all summer and fall and I don't think she's hit anything more than singles. she hasn't been striking out either but she hasn't been hitting the ball as hard as she used to. I can work with her on that, but she doesn't seem interested-which is another thing, she seems to have lost interest in things that she says she likes to do..it's weird but hopefully we can get it all straightened out.

thanks for asking!

 

[Country Boy]

This is a philosophy that drives me nuts. I know it worked for Ted W. So what? Why not just instruct the Umpire that you want to start with a 0-1 count. That will accomplish about as much as always taking the first pitch. Now, I don't encourage a free swing at 0-0. As many have suggested, pick a spot and look for the pitch there. Otherwise, take. But don't forfeit your right to what is probably the best pitch you will see.

I had a girl this last summer that had the philosophy of taking the first pitch. Her normal at bat became: Take the first one down the middle. Then, because we were anxious being behind in the count, she flailed at the next pitch no matter where it was. Then she would take strike 3. Some variation, but that was close. It wasn't until the last couple weeks of season, that she listened and got better.

At 18U, pitchers are too good and too smart to consistently give them a strike. My #1 gets excited when facing teams that do this. She realizes she will have to make a big mistake in order for them to get a hit. Because after she throws one down the middle, she will fill them up with junk on the corners. That's when we really see popups on the infield!

As I mentioned above, I talk to my hitters about the strike zone. I encourage them to use a strike zone about the size of a shoe box until they take a strike. When they are coming up to bat, identify the area you want to cover and swing at a pitch in that zone. Other wise leave it alone. After you get a strike, expand your zone some. After you get 2 strikes on you, expand it again until you are attacking any hittable ball. Part of this philosophy is I want aggressive hitters. Willfully taking pitches is passive. I want hitters swinging at balls they are ready for and can crush. But that is my philosophy. We all have our own.

If your daughter is that good a hitter, though, she probably needs to look at the coaches, nod her head and say "I'll work on it." Then hit her way.

 

[softballphreak]

Knowing a batter will watch the first pitch gives the pitcher a huge advantage. Hot fast ball down the middle, strike 1; offspeed inside strike, foul ball, strike 2; huge advantage.


What they should be told: look for a pitch you can hit well; otherwise be willing to take a strike or a ball. Keep that in mind until they get a strike.

 

[obbay]

Knowing a batter will watch the first pitch gives the pitcher a huge advantage.

how does a pitcher know the batter is taking the first strike unless they know the batter?

I encourage them to use a strike zone about the size of a shoe box until they take a strike. When they are coming up to bat, identify the area you want to cover and swing at a pitch in that zone. Other wise leave it alone. After you get a strike, expand your zone some. After you get 2 strikes on you, expand it again until you are attacking any hittable ball.

I am absolutely a believer in this! But now that you mention it, I really should reaquaint DD with the concept.

she is comfortable taking pitches and seeing what the pitcher has because she knows she will hit the ball. but right now maybe it's more of a crutch. I'll talk to her about first-pitch hitting and expecting the meatball until the pitch proves otherwise.

 

[CoogansBluff]

at her last game, a couple of coaches were discussing working the count vs swinging at any pitch you think is a strike.

There is a big difference between what you are saying here - 'swinging at any pitch you think is a strike' - and what you originally said - 'swing at the first GOOD pitch she sees.'

''Swinging at any pitch you think is a strike'' applies only when you have two strikes against you. You must protect the plate or be struck out.

But on the first pitch, you don't want to swing at strikes that are difficult to hit. Wait for a GOOD one. But if the first pitch is a GOOD pitch to hit, then hit it.

 

[obbay]

They want them swinging at any pitch that looks good from their bucket.

my issue is differentiating between getting a good cut at a good pitch and just taking a cut at a pitch because it's a strike.
They are assuming the swing and timing will be perfect. I see this akin to the coaches who claim "defense wins games" where they are assuming there will be enough offense to win.
There is no talk of pitch selection or discipline at the plate, which is what most of the responses here are getting at. IF the first pitch is a beauty, then crank it!
(The actual quote was "...defense wins Championships" and it was Bear Bryant talking about Football. Softball (and Baseball) are two of the few sports where you cannot score while playing defense.)